Over fertilized or underfed?

Star Dog said:

The run off value tells me the plants are getting the right amount of feeding for the conditions, if my run off starts to rise in ec I know I have to back of a bit, if the run off falls bellow 0.6 I need to increase it a bit there hungry, if its 2.0 I know I've got build up and need to rinse it out, if i remember anymore I'll add them, thumbs.

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Testing runoff and pH is creating some false belief here, if you can't make soil work without doing that then stop commenting on it to others and find the discussion where it's not happening so you can learn what everyone else does.

Tetrahedral said:

Testing runoff and pH is creating some false belief here, if you can't make soil work without doing that then stop commenting on it to others and find the discussion where it's not happening so you can learn what everyone else does.

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@Tetrahedral you say it is not required and is a "false belief". Yet, you have said nothing to support your statement.
Yes, soil pH is buffering and alkalinity is modulated by cohesive forces. However, to say that using buffered water is not required is non-sense.

Many a good soil grows have been saved by adding adjusted pH water.

Tetrahedral said:

Testing runoff and pH is creating some false belief here, if you can't make soil work without doing that then stop commenting on it to others and find the discussion where it's not happening so you can learn what everyone else does.

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I'm not at all with you?
If I can't make soil work doing what?
Most important I'm not interested in what others do I'm well experienced and I'm happy to share my experience with the chap that asked what I get from testing the run off.

You can believe its false if you like but I know after nearly 30 years measuring the run off is valuable.

Dabbie McDoob said:

@Tetrahedral you say it is not required and is a "false belief". Yet, you have said nothing to support your statement.
Yes, soil pH is buffering and alkalinity is modulated by cohesive forces. However, to say that using buffered water is not required is non-sense.

Many a good soil grows have been saved by adding adjusted pH water.

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Lol I thought it was me you were referring!

Dabbie McDoob said:

@Tetrahedral you say it is not required and is a "false belief". Yet, you have said nothing to support your statement.
Yes, soil pH is buffering and alkalinity is modulated by cohesive forces. However, to say that using buffered water is not required is non-sense.

Many a good soil grows have been saved by adding adjusted pH water.

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Lol Thd must be the forum expert

Cheers SD

Dabbie McDoob said:

@Tetrahedral you say it is not required and is a "false belief". Yet, you have said nothing to support your statement.
Yes, soil pH is buffering and alkalinity is modulated by cohesive forces. However, to say that using buffered water is not required is non-sense.

Many a good soil grows have been saved by adding adjusted pH water.

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What are you buffering?

300ppm carbonates sulphates and chlorides;

How the fuck does 300ppm imbalance soil pH or buffer.

Do you understand the science behind soils? The evidence would be you getting educated about this stuff, then you would understand my reply.

Wasn't saying this to argue, your argument is with all the people who buy a bag of soil, take it home and grow lots of veg flowers fruit houseplants and don't do all the idiotic things you do. Follow them not some idiot on a cannabis site, I know how to garden not grow weed, that grows me some good weed. Work it out!

@Tetrahedral Fwiw I thought we were talking about a hydro substrate and nutrient, I'm not familiar with the lingo I'm afraid.
I know absolutely nothing about growing in soil, peace

SD

Tetrahedral said:

What are you buffering?

300ppm carbonates sulphates and chlorides;

How the fuck does 300ppm imbalance soil pH or buffer.

Do you understand the science behind soils? The evidence would be you getting educated about this stuff, then you would understand my reply.

Wasn't saying this to argue, your argument is with all the people who buy a bag of soil, take it home and grow lots of veg flowers fruit houseplants and don't do all the idiotic things you do. Follow them not some idiot on a cannabis site, I know how to garden not grow weed, that grows me some good weed. Work it out!

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Lol, stick to your T5 grows and delusions about being a scientist there @Tetrahedral.
Idiots on Cannabis site? Lot's of super awesome growers on here.
Final.

^ you could also be less of a twat and give information without all the shit slinging. I guess you're just too insecure to do so.

Star Dog said:

@Tetrahedral Fwiw I thought we were talking about a hydro substrate and nutrient, I'm not familiar with the lingo I'm afraid.
I know absolutely nothing about growing in soil, peace

SD

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It's ok.

Dabbie McDoob said:

Lol, stick to your T5 grows and delusions about being a scientist there @Tetrahedral.
Idiots on Cannabis site? Lot's of super awesome growers on here.
Final.

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Your type of reply and limited intelligence is the general response, if you didn't an awesome grower might turn up and have a real conversation about soil pH and chasing your tail reading runoff.

You don't understand and don't want to, you were never hear for the correct answer just to argue.

Tetrahedral said:

Your type of reply and limited intelligence is the general response, if you didn't an awesome grower might turn up and have a real conversation about soil pH and chasing your tail reading runoff.

You don't understand and don't want to, you were never hear for the correct answer just to argue.

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As I said I wrongly thought we were talking about substrate and nutrient, I'd be interested to hear just for curiosity sake, the chances of me growing in soil are very slim but I'd still like to learn about it if you don't mind giving a brief overview of soil pH.

Cheers SD

Star Dog said:

As I said I wrongly thought we were talking about substrate and nutrient, I'd be interested to hear just for curiosity sake, the chances of me growing in soil are very slim but I'd still like to learn about it if you don't mind giving a brief overview of soil pH.

Cheers SD

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Fertilizer produces a small amount of acid, lime in soil neutralises that. A lot of fungi and bacteria also do the same by processing nutrients and organic matter. It's so complex you just need to give it the nutrients it wants and leave it do its job. Trying to pH such a big system via a small buffer in water won't do anything. Water is made up of minor amounts of minerals, if your water isn't really hard high ppm water then the soil will not be affected, you can get a water report to check but if you drink it it's most likely great for plants too.

Hydro is a solution based media and pH is based on every ion in the solution, we need to balance that ionic budget, soil is opposite and balances itself, hydro is 1500ppm maybe max, 300ppm will make a difference, soil is high and not a simple solution, pH will do nothing except increase nitrogen or potassium as that's what they are made off.

Organic pH down are just going to get eaten and not pH the soil, add lemon juice and you add sugar yum yum, add vinegar and add acetic acid, not yum yum but some bacteria will think yum yum.

The average person who buys bagged soil is growing veg flowers or potted plants, I don't see them using meters and pH products, they just got a bottle of ferts and twenty years experience.

Keep it simple, what it was mass produced for.

is this seriously an argument about phing soil...

jees , email any soil manufacturer and ask.
soil buffers ph you cannot change its ph except through absolute extremes by which stage your soil is completely ruined and your plant history.

my advice is use grow and bloom products according to the manufacturers recommendations, most supply a feeding chart. Then add less if necessary. Throw your ph up and down and ec meter in the drawer for when you try hydro.





no phing, no ec reading.

just follow the labels and read the plants.

if they look pale add more , too green add less

so this is two days after I fed at full strength roots organic master pack. They look even more messed up than before and that taking the advice of not phing and feed full dose of nutes

I am thinking I have nutrient lockout which makes those suggestions bad in my situation

puffdatchronic said:

is this seriously an argument about phing soil...

jees , email any soil manufacturer and ask.
soil buffers ph you cannot change its ph except through absolute extremes by which stage your soil is completely ruined and your plant history.

my advice is use grow and bloom products according to the manufacturers recommendations, most supply a feeding chart. Then add less if necessary. Throw your ph up and down and ec meter in the drawer for when you try hydro.


View attachment 4673828


no phing, no ec reading.

just follow the labels and read the plants.

if they look pale add more , too green add less

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They looked pale so I added and now they look really bad

are you sure you arent or werent at the beginning overwatering?

I think the feed did green them up a bit , they dont look really really bad , i see a lot of nice buds there you will still get a harvest

puffdatchronic said:

I think the feed did green them up a bit , they dont look really really bad , i see a lot of nice buds there you will still get a harvest

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The back left plant definitely got over watered, was out all day and came home to her being under watered and watered way to fast but the others haven’t showed and signs of dropping or anything. Tomorrow I’m going to run some plain water through to get ph back down to normal. Last I checked it was 7.1-7.2