Please help my ph problem

xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
Checking pH from runoff is a waste of time because it's highly inaccurate. Forgetting the fact that you're wasting your time to begin with. If you want to check soil pH you might as well do it correctly. There are two methods I'll list from Hanna's website. One uses a standard pH probe for liquid and the other uses a soil pH probe. You have been wasting your time measuring runoff. And you're wasting your time chasing pH.


http://blog.hannainst.com/soil-ph-testing#6

How to Test Soil pHslurry testing and direct soil testing. It is important that the soil samples and tests take place in the same spots and the same way every time.

Slurry pH Testing
The slurry method allows you to get a representative sample and measurement of an entire area with just one test. Because soil pH can vary within a small area, be sure to take a representative sample. The soil should be taken from the same depth below the surface each time you test.

When using the slurry method, take soil from next to the plants, as well as some from further away. (Keep these two samples separate.) While this means a little extra work, you will get measurements that are more accurate since the amount of nutrients, types of soil, and moisture content can vary across a planted area.

All these things affect the pH of soil, so it's important to track your pH at many points.

How to Test Soil Using the Slurry Method
  1. Gather some soil from the test area.
  2. Take the homogeneous sample and add equal parts of soil and distilled or deionized (DI) water in a 1:1 ratio. So, for 25 grams of soil you would add 25 mL of water.
  3. Stir the sample for 5 seconds.
  4. Let it sit for 15 minutes.
  5. Start stirring the sample again after 15 minutes, and take your measurement.
Video: How to Prepare a Soil Slurry (1 minute 40 seconds)




Direct Soil pH Testing
Direct soil pH testing gives you the benefit of not needing to take soil samples, because the pH is tested right in the ground.

How to Test Directly in Soil
  1. Using an auger or ruler, first put a hole down into the soil. The hole needs to be the same depth each time you test to avoid pH discrepancies.
  2. Add some distilled or deionized water to the hole; the soil should be damp but not saturated with water.
  3. Insert your testing instrument into the hole, and allow for the reading to develop or stabilize.
 
vtim802

vtim802

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the last two posts, and for the third to last post, ill just ignore lol. i understand my readings might not be conpletely accurate, i have two cheap ph pens and the strips. i use ph calibration liquid to recalibrate my pens every 20 readings( or times im being approximate) and i also double check with the drops to make sure im not way off. i store the pens in ph storage somutions ( different than the cali ration fluids ) anyways now that the plants look alot better, im onto the next issue, humidity. any good suggestions on what i should use to keep it in a good range? right now i use a vicks cool mist hunidifier, it doesnt store alot of water ( constantly refilling) and i turn it off at night, lest my temp drops to around 62-64 degrees F. hey thanks for the positive responses, and for the guy who thought they needed fert lol, youre funny, bet youre real funny in person lol. ill post some updated pics on how my ph has corrected the new leaves later. thanks
 
vtim802

vtim802

Well-Known Member
my cheap chinese ph pens are spot on btw, i calibrated them less than a week ago and when i watered yesterday, the drops matched the ph pens. i use two pens everytime i test and also always use the drops afterwards, so pretty confident they are accurate. realistically as long as they are .25 accurate its fine because i am only looking for a range of ph 6-7 in soil so as long as i stay around 6.5 we should be good
 
vtim802

vtim802

Well-Known Member
pulpoinspace said:
hi vtim

i saw that you added dolomite lime to your soil mix which is a buffer to bring up pH. FFOF has oystershell lime in it. That is also buffer to raise pH. FFHF has oystershell lime and dolomite lime. all this lime brings the pH up in your soil. now i dont make my own soils so i don't know how much lime is too much, but my guess is you can overdo it. if fox farm (company that makes soils) puts a certain amount of lime in their soil, why do you feel like you need to add more?

what are you using to check exact pH to two decimal points? that worries me. soil growers should need the color changing drops at most. if its one of those cheap pH pens from amazon just throw it in the garbage right now.
I know it may seem like i'm piling on or trying to give you a hard time but i'm really not. the reason people grow in soil and use pH buffers is so they do not have to worry about checking pH. if your soil has pH buffers, you just water it with nutes. when you water, soil naturally becomes acidic and then the buffers bring it back up. then, checking runoff you see is completely pointless. as long as your solution is anywhere close to the correct pH your soil should take care of the rest. only time pH would become a problem is if you keep a plant in the same soil for extended periods, overwater and deplete the pH buffer.

i hope this clears up what people are trying to say here

as an aside, i am a soil grower too. and i used to be very concerned with pH. a lot of these same guys in this thread convinced me that the buffers in my soil were sufficient. i tried their advice, and they were right. now i'm not saying you should completely ignore pH of your tap water. sure, add a touch of pH down if you want to lock the solution in the ballpark, but its probably unnecessary. And at least stop checking the runoff.

good luck.
Click to expand...
THANK YOU

this has explained alot, i did amend my ffof, ffhf and perlite soil mix with one tablespoon of dolomite lime per 5gallons of soil mix. i had read about how soil stuff changes ph but didnt really understand it, im learning how it works better and your post helped my mind grasp what is going on. thanks for actually reading some of my past posts and actually put some thought into your reply, it explained alot to me. ill follow up in a few days to a week and see how they are turning out. i dont have the experience or the confidence to not check ph or runoff yet. im measuring what i can to try to understand what is happening before going no ph on everything, hopefully that will be in the future with the exp i pick up after a few grows. thanks man for the support, unlike some other people on here, ill post some updates soon enough thanks again!!
 
xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
It doesn't matter what you use to measure. The runoff from soil is highly inaccurate as a measurement for soil pH. If you are going to measure soil pH do it correctly. The strips will work for a slurry test. I measure soil pH in my outdoor garden using the slurry test and the same Blue Lab pH pen I use when I mix nutrient solutions for grows in coco.

I still think you're wasting your time worrying about pH so much but if you really want to measure it at least do it properly.

For those plants I would make sure not to over water and give them just plain water for the next week and then maybe half strength nutes and then a feed - water -water -feed -water -water regimen. I bet if you leave them alone and stop fiddling they will start doing just fine.
 
Kingrow1

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
DangerDavez said:
May not wanna ignore your humidity levels...
Click to expand...
Humidity is only a problem if it is extreme, you may note that marijuana is perfectly happy in a variety of humidities.

We merely refer a humidity under 70% for flowering due to bud rot, certainly the plant is fine to grow at this.

Again more broscience, what a site....
 
D

DangerDavez

Well-Known Member
Kingrow1 said:
Humidity is only a problem if it is extreme, you may note that marijuana is perfectly happy in a variety of humidities.

We merely refer a humidity under 70% for flowering due to bud rot, certainly the plant is fine to grow at this.

Again more broscience, what a site....
Click to expand...
His was 30 percent. Get it up to at least 45. It's not bro science it's a fact.
 
Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
vtim802 said:
my cheap chinese ph pens are spot on btw, i calibrated them less than a week ago and when i watered yesterday, the drops matched the ph pens. i use two pens everytime i test and also always use the drops afterwards, so pretty confident they are accurate. realistically as long as they are .25 accurate its fine because i am only looking for a range of ph 6-7 in soil so as long as i stay around 6.5 we should be good
Click to expand...
ph your feed going in, then put the fucking ph pens away and leave them away till you make more nutes.......if you don't know a shit load more than you do at the moment, run off ph means absolutely nothing.....you don't know why it's not the same as what you put in, you don't know what the difference means, and you don't know what to do about it, even if you knew what it meant....so don't.....don't check it...don't look at it....don't worry about it.....
king is right, and so is DD...plants like high humidity....and can grow in a wide range of humidity...but if you let it get too low, it can cause a lot of problems. the plant will transpire more, so it draws more water from it's roots. that water will have nutes in it, so you can be overfeeding at low rh, with a low ppm....let the rh get too high, and you'll start getting powdery mildew, mold, all kinds of bad shit....so 60% or so in veg is a good idea, trying to stay below 50% in flower is good. they'd both like higher rh, but so do mold, spores, and fungi......
 
vtim802

vtim802

Well-Known Member
Roger A. Shrubber said:
ph your feed going in, then put the fucking ph pens away and leave them away till you make more nutes.......if you don't know a shit load more than you do at the moment, run off ph means absolutely nothing.....you don't know why it's not the same as what you put in, you don't know what the difference means, and you don't know what to do about it, even if you knew what it meant....so don't.....don't check it...don't look at it....don't worry about it.....
king is right, and so is DD...plants like high humidity....and can grow in a wide range of humidity...but if you let it get too low, it can cause a lot of problems. the plant will transpire more, so it draws more water from it's roots. that water will have nutes in it, so you can be overfeeding at low rh, with a low ppm....let the rh get too high, and you'll start getting powdery mildew, mold, all kinds of bad shit....so 60% or so in veg is a good idea, trying to stay below 50% in flower is good. they'd both like higher rh, but so do mold, spores, and fungi......
Click to expand...
yeah i need to find a better solution than what i have going now for humidity. but on the bright side shouldnt be an issue keeping it down during flowering if i can get through my veg
 
vtim802

vtim802

Well-Known Member
The new growth is looking alot better. The last watering i posted about yesterday went in at 5.8-5.9, i will continue not phing my nute going in. these are pics today

Small plant
the new growth is not twisting and canoeing like the two fan leaves above and below in the pictures





big plant
looks good i think, any suggestions from this picture?
will this plant produce 12 colas from how i have it topped and trained?








close up of leaves on small plant that led to the original post they feel dry, brittle and they literally have ridges on them. a few of them have curled into themselves like a dry tobacco leaf lol.

Should i defoliate these leaves? Is there any benefit to keeping them on for now? Even in their damaged state are they still helping the plant? i do not know about how the plants use and store energy in the leaves ? looking to learn more about the situation





 
D

DangerDavez

Well-Known Member
vtim802 said:
i been running the cool mist its teetering around 38-42 rh today. i know i gotta find a better solution, the further into the year it gets it will only get drier, youre right.
Click to expand...
Sorry I didn't want to derail your thread but I just couldn't help but notice it was a bit lower than optimal. And that's why we grow indoor is to optimize everything. I had low humidity too and my plants had similar symptoms as yours so it may be a contributing factor.

Their was a good post on how to check PH a few posts up . I did the water probe PH method as described above and it worked very well. If you can dial it in around 6.5 you're good as Cannabis, like tomato plants, intake all their nutrients at slightly acidic pH levels. Hydro you want to run around 5.8. Now you said your PH is slightly high so the plants may not be able to properly intake phosphate and I believe that could be an issue and Magnesium is a possibility but it doesn't look like either of those.

To me this looks more like an EXCESS of either nitrogen, magnesium or calcium and seeing as you've been adding a lot of cal mag I believe that could be the issue.

My advice is to PH the soil, report back. If the PH is good, you may want to feed with just water a couple days.
 
Bernie420

Bernie420

Well-Known Member
vtim802 said:
The new growth is looking alot better. The last watering i posted about yesterday went in at 5.8-5.9, i will continue not phing my nute going in. these are pics today

Small plant
the new growth is not twisting and canoeing like the two fan leaves above and below in the pictures





big plant
looks good i think, any suggestions from this picture?
will this plant produce 12 colas from how i have it topped and trained?








close up of leaves on small plant that led to the original post they feel dry, brittle and they literally have ridges on them. a few of them have curled into themselves like a dry tobacco leaf lol.

Should i defoliate these leaves? Is there any benefit to keeping them on for now? Even in their damaged state are they still helping the plant? i do not know about how the plants use and store energy in the leaves ? looking to learn more about the situation





Click to expand...

weird you posted that you will continue NOT ph-ing nute water going in and we all say that you should ph nute water going in.
 
vtim802

vtim802

Well-Known Member
no i meant not to change it, im still going to check the reading. im have been using canna bio veg and it says right on the directions not to ph the bio canna line
 
vtim802

vtim802

Well-Known Member
Bernie420 said:
weird you posted that you will continue NOT ph-ing nute water going in and we all say that you should ph nute water going in.
Click to expand...
my problem has been that I HAVE been ph ing my water to 6.5-6.6 going in and in my notes my ph runoff was coming out too high, plants are looking much better now that i havent been phing the water BACK UP to get to 6.5, rather than leaving it at 5.9-6.0 which is what the bio vege makes my nutrient solution
 
vtim802

vtim802

Well-Known Member
Should i defoliate the old leaves? did you see that question? are they helping or hindering the plant? one of the leaves kinda looks like its unrolling but they are just fan leaves so i dont know
 
Bernie420

Bernie420

Well-Known Member
vtim802 said:
Should i defoliate the old leaves? did you see that question? are they helping or hindering the plant? one of the leaves kinda looks like its unrolling but they are just fan leaves so i dont know
Click to expand...
if its not blocking something then leave them imo plants are too small to worry about defoliation right now.

get some microbes in there also
 
Bernie420

Bernie420

Well-Known Member
vtim802 said:
my problem has been that I HAVE been ph ing my water to 6.5-6.6 going in and in my notes my ph runoff was coming out too high, plants are looking much better now that i havent been phing the water BACK UP to get to 6.5, rather than leaving it at 5.9-6.0 which is what the bio vege makes my nutrient solution
Click to expand...
Whatever problem you have more than likely isnt because you ph-ed your water before you fed the plants.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top