Should the US shed blood for Ukraine

Should the USA along with NATO defend Ukraine with troops.

  • Yes

    Votes: 40 40.4%

  • No

    Votes: 59 59.6%
  • Total voters
    99
Giggsy70

Giggsy70

Well-Known Member
Wait until Putin invades another country, more than likely a NATO nation. Xi will invade Taiwan, because he will know how stretched out the US will be.
 
amneziaHaze

amneziaHaze

Well-Known Member
if us doesnt help, xi will know US will not help he can attack. if US helps, he knows troops are in russia he can attack. soo win win for him.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Roger A. Shrubber said:
on the surface i think you made a valid assumption, based on the available facts and history of putin, and the area.
i think putin has some kind of plan that we in the west aren't aware of. it's the only thing that justifies his seemingly insane behavior.
this will extend his troops as far as they can be extended. he won't have the man power to both hold the area against the surely coming attacks from rebel forces, and engage in any kind of large scale offensive OR defensive actions...
this all makes me think he has an ally we aren't aware of...and the only candidate that fits that bill is Xi Jinping.
Ukraine has a lot of resources sitting under it, and russia and china both wouldn't mind getting their hands on all of it they can, and really, who else does russia have left to trade with? are they going to trade lng for crude oil with arabia?
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From what I've seen, Biden has been spot on and very open about saying what Putin will do before he does it.

Biden is warning "other nations" they face severe sanctions if they ignore the sanctions put on Russia. Is China's economy large enough to sustain them?

1645730858265.png

They projected 6% growth this year.

Then again, I'm assuming Mr Xi will act in his self interest and his interests are aligned with the people. Putin shook that assumption up for me yesterday.

Putting it out there for comment.
 
BudmanTX

BudmanTX

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
From what I've seen, Biden has been spot on and very open about saying what Putin will do before he does it.

Biden is warning "other nations" they face severe sanctions if they ignore the sanctions put on Russia. Is China's economy large enough to sustain them?

View attachment 5091528

They projected 6% growth this year.

Then again, I'm assuming Mr Xi will act in his self interest and his interests are aligned with the people. Putin shook that assumption up for me yesterday.

Putting it out there for comment.
Click to expand...
i thought china's economy was tanking? and if Russia goes to China with will hurt both of they're economies and hurt China......i could be wrong
 
amneziaHaze

amneziaHaze

Well-Known Member
soo europe said we will cut you off from SWIFT putin said that will mean war. they said okey we will not cut you XD. even biden today didnt want to say he will sanciton russia
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
BudmanTX said:
i thought china's economy was tanking? and if Russia goes to China with will hurt both of they're economies and hurt China......i could be wrong
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Depends on how one looks at it. Purchasing power per person is better for the average Chinese citizen than the US. From that vantage point they are doing great. GDP per capita has declined precipitously ever since the great recession. From that vantage point they are sucking. Both can't be true.

Truman said he wanted a one armed economist working for him because then he wouldn't have to hear "on the other hand".
 
BudmanTX

BudmanTX

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Depends on how one looks at it. Purchasing power per person is better for the average Chinese citizen than the US. From that vantage point they are doing great. GDP per capita has declined precipitously ever since the great recession. From that vantage point they are sucking. Both can't be true.

Truman said he wanted a one armed economist working for him because then he wouldn't have to hear "on the other hand".
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interesting.....hmm....i've heard, and i stress that, that with the epidemic and all China is hurting.......

just for the sake of it, i did this.....
1 Chinese Yuan equals
13.57 Russian Ruble
 
Sativied

Sativied

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
The null hypothesis was that Putin would not invade Ukraine. My reason for this is Ukraine wasn't/isn't worth the cost.

So, let me ask you and anyone who reads this. Is that assumption wrong too?
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Still seems like a reasonable assumption for a reasonable person to make. Not just saying that cause I too, at least till a few days ago, didn’t expect he would invade Ukraine beyond the recently recognized areas. It’s just that I never would have thought Putin to be this unreasonable/dumb/crazy. Crimea by itself is already an economic disaster, no way he can afford to control over 40mil people in Ukraine.

Besides the economical costs, it doesn’t look like the Russians are very happy with Putin right now:
www.theguardian.com

Thousands join anti-war protests in Russia after Ukraine invasion

Police make more than 1,700 arrests as protesters take to the streets in cities across countryRussia-Ukraine crisis: live updates
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
amneziaHaze said:
if us doesnt help, xi will know US will not help he can attack. if US helps, he knows troops are in russia he can attack. soo win win for him.
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That logic goes back almost three thousand years. Zhou dynasty stuff. China's history is fascinating to me.

Do you think Biden doesn't know that and hasn't taken it into consideration?

There is no greater danger than underestimating your enemy.
 
amneziaHaze

amneziaHaze

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
That logic goes back almost three thousand years. Zhou dynasty stuff. China's history is fascinating to me.

Do you think Biden doesn't know that and has taken it into consideration?

There is no greater danger than underestimating your enemy.
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thats why china isnt doing anything yet. best outcome is for usa to attack russia. allsoo last 5 years you lost wargames to china. i hope it was not played strongest.
 
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