Slow growth and drooping leaves in bubbleponic system

Hey guys,

here is one of my jack herer seedlings that is in a homemade dwc bubbleponics system. Air temps are mid 70s to low 80s dropping to mid-high 60s at night, humidity is 50-70%, water temp is a constant 68F (res chiller), ph ranges from 5.5-6.5. They are vegging under a 250w blue cfl that is hung about 6 inches away.

I'm using tap water which I know to be fine. I've got a 10gph air pump which is connected to six 12 inch air stones creating loads of tiny bubbles. A 220gph water pump connected to a manifold feeds the plants with highly oxygenated water.

As far as I'm aware all conditions are at optimum and i strive to keep them that way. Unfortunately as you can see, it's not all going well. This seedling is 13 days old, drooping leaves that are going a lime green colour at the tips slightly and still has no roots poking out the bottom of the netcup. I have one other seedling and it is in a similar condition. When i look at other bubbleponic grows, plants of this age are normally far more advanced =S



The only thing i can think of is that the water coming out of the manifold isn't a trickle, it's more of a stream - could my water pump be too powerful, and thus be overwatering the plants?



Should I try just removing the feeder tubes and just going dwc?

Sorry for the camera phone pics, but any help would be greatly appreciated, this is my third attempt at bubbleponics and i dont want to fail again!

With the overkill in air stones, you could remove the pump and tubes and let the bubbles bounce up on the roots, IF YOU HAD ROOTS.

I can not see or diagnois what is wrong.

Are you feeding it? How much?

Did you add anything strange or different like peroxide? (not that peroxide is bad)

Look at mine here



This is 5 days earlier and 5 days after the seeds popped..






5 days after my seeds pooped, these were much bigger than yours at 12 days, so something is defintiely wrong, might be the seeds, I just do not know.

sophanox said:

Hey guys,

here is one of my jack herer seedlings that is in a homemade dwc bubbleponics system. Air temps are mid 70s to low 80s dropping to mid-high 60s at night, humidity is 50-70%, water temp is a constant 68F (res chiller), ph ranges from 5.5-6.5. They are vegging under a 250w blue cfl that is hung about 6 inches away.

I'm using tap water which I know to be fine. I've got a 10gph air pump which is connected to six 12 inch air stones creating loads of tiny bubbles. A 220gph water pump connected to a manifold feeds the plants with highly oxygenated water.

As far as I'm aware all conditions are at optimum and i strive to keep them that way. Unfortunately as you can see, it's not all going well. This seedling is 13 days old, drooping leaves that are going a lime green colour at the tips slightly and still has no roots poking out the bottom of the netcup. I have one other seedling and it is in a similar condition. When i look at other bubbleponic grows, plants of this age are normally far more advanced =S



The only thing i can think of is that the water coming out of the manifold isn't a trickle, it's more of a stream - could my water pump be too powerful, and thus be overwatering the plants?



Should I try just removing the feeder tubes and just going dwc?

Sorry for the camera phone pics, but any help would be greatly appreciated, this is my third attempt at bubbleponics and i dont want to fail again!

Click to expand...

I can't see the pictures, but from what you describe it does sound like they are being overwatered a bit. I would agree that your pump might be too powerful, is the manifold adjustable so that you can slow down the stream to a trickle or drip? Or you could put the pump on a cheap timer, 15 minutes on 45 minutes off, to give the roots a chance to breath and spread out (seek water).

Just my opinion...

Yeah I was comparing my growth with yours roseman and yours is considerably more advanced =( - I am not feeding them anything, they are just recieving plain tap water.


Dysotopia, unfortunately I can't adjust my manifold, though I actually might try connecting all four of the netcups to one manifold output using T joints in the tubing to help reduce water flow. Putting the pump on a timer is also a good idea - I will try that too.

Thanks for all the help so far =)

Start 1/4 dose of recommended nutrients asap.

Follow along with me, in my Tutorial, and look at pages around 8, 9 or ten, when I germianted adn started mine. Roseman's DIY Bubbleponics Tutorial - Marijuana Growing

Yeah I followed your tutorial to a tee roseman, it's amazing thanks a lot

With regards to nutes, i thought I was meant to wait till three sets of leaves? I will be using floranova btw, not SH nutes

sophanox said:

Yeah I was comparing my growth with yours roseman and yours is considerably more advanced =( - I am not feeding them anything, they are just recieving plain tap water.


Dysotopia, unfortunately I can't adjust my manifold, though I actually might try connecting all four of the netcups to one manifold output using T joints in the tubing to help reduce water flow. Putting the pump on a timer is also a good idea - I will try that too.

Thanks for all the help so far =)

Click to expand...

You can also stick a valve between the water pump and manifold to easily control flow rate. Assuming you have 1/2" inner diameter tubing coming from the pump, something like this would work:

http://www.dripirrigation.com/drip_irrigation_info.php?cPath=35&products_id=61

If the tubing coming from the pump is a different size then get the approprate sized valve. Just turn the knob until you get the flow rate you want. Home Depot or equivalent carries these.

Wicked thanks a lot guys - it turns out i can adjust the valves on my manifold to reduce water flow - so I have done that and it is much more of a trickle now, rather than blasting out like it was before. So hopefully this will solve the problem

One last question though, should I turn off the pump for a while and let the rockwool cubes dry out a bit? or just keep the pump going?

Cheers

sophanox said:

Wicked thanks a lot guys - it turns out i can adjust the valves on my manifold to reduce water flow - so I have done that and it is much more of a trickle now, rather than blasting out like it was before. So hopefully this will solve the problem

One last question though, should I turn off the pump for a while and let the rockwool cubes dry out a bit? or just keep the pump going?

Cheers

Click to expand...

keep it pumping.

Roseman said:

keep it pumping.

Click to expand...

sound mate, will do! Out of interest, when you look at the water coming out the bottom your the netcups, is it a continuous stream, or does it drip, but really fast?

Thanks again!

sophanox said:

Wicked thanks a lot guys - it turns out i can adjust the valves on my manifold to reduce water flow - so I have done that and it is much more of a trickle now, rather than blasting out like it was before. So hopefully this will solve the problem

One last question though, should I turn off the pump for a while and let the rockwool cubes dry out a bit? or just keep the pump going?

Cheers

Click to expand...

No, you wan't to keep the rockwool wet. Dont turn off ther pump now that you solved your problem by adjusting the water flow to a trickle.

thanks mate - can anyone describe what the water coming out the bottom of their netpots look like - i've set mine to a very small trickle that is just about a continuous stream - does that sound right?

Cheers =)

sophanox said:

sound mate, will do! Out of interest, when you look at the water coming out the bottom your the netcups, is it a continuous stream, or does it drip, but really fast?

Thanks again!

Click to expand...

I see a fast steady drip or a very slow weak thin trickle.

Roseman said:

I see a fast steady drip or a very slow weak thin trickle.

Click to expand...

perfect mate, just what i needed, thanks a lot!

Are they growing? looking any better?

sophanox said:

thanks mate - can anyone describe what the water coming out the bottom of their netpots look like - i've set mine to a very small trickle that is just about a continuous stream - does that sound right?

Cheers =)

Click to expand...

Like Roseman said
You just want to see that the cubes are wet and not drying out.

Roseman said:

Are they growing? looking any better?

Click to expand...

well they have always been growing, albeit very slowly - i can't see any difference between from when the water was at full blast compared to now when it is a trickle, the leaves are still droopy. but it has only been a day and i expect it'll take them a little longer to bounce back.

fingers crossed they do though, otherwise i have no clue what it could be - other than the water itself, but the water where i'm from is the some of the purest in the world so meh =S

i've got some money atm so i ordered some rhizotonic n some superthrive so hopefully these will help in the recovery =)

thanks for the continued interest though roseman and cheers hgh, i have adjusted it accordingly!

Man, I think you should get that Rockwool out of there ASAP, gently shake the excess water out and let it sit under 24 hour light until a long ass tap root sticks out of the bottom. Make sure to keep the Rockwool damp, not soaking wet. Then, you could put it back in the Hydroton but don't let the Rockwool get that wet as you did. I think that's part of whats causing the slow growth.

Also, I recommend that you filter your water and test the PH. Since the source of your tap is a natural source, it probably has a lot of minerals in there. Problem is that when you add nutes, you're also adding minerals that are already in the water which causes an overload. Also, your tap might be salty which is bad from what I understand since the plant's roots leave salts behind as they're growing. I just started a DWC grow myself and recently, my mother plant's leaves at the bottom started yellowing. I decided to change out the nutes and flush the Rockwool, Hydroton and roots. As I was flushing, I was surprised to see the amount of solid salt chunks not only coming out of the Hydroton but a massive amount coming out of the Rockwool cube.

One last thing about tap water. I tried using it when I started my DWC but when I would pre mix some nute solution, a layer of this thick crust would form by the next day. I started filtering my water through a Brita and now when I pre mix some solution, I could let it sit for days and the solution is still crystal clear and no crust on the top. There's something nasty in tap water, I'm telling ya.

btw sophanox, you from the UK? You use the terms, Mate and Cheers.

Thanks for that informative post petrol420 - aye I thought letting the rockwool dry out a bit was a good idea too, but other more experienced growers than me recommended to just leave the pump on, but with the manifold adjusted to allow only a trickle.

If they dont recover and continue to grow slowly I will have to look at the water as it's the only possible factor left. However, I did a soil grow prior to this and I never came across this crust you described. My tap water comes out at 0.05ec with a ph of 7.2 so it's pretty pure stuff - but I will defo bear that mineral build up in mind when (or if =S) I start using nutes.

yep i am from the uk =P very perceptive of you!

The plants have grown since I last posted, but no major spurts - still seems very slow. But this is only the second day now since identifying the problem so..

Is this normal do you think for them to take a while to bounce back? I know overwatering in soil can slow or stunt growth for a week or so, wonder if it's the same for hydro...?

Thanks all