Starting seeds in Rapid Rooters?

I don't have good luck with germinating seeds or keeping them alive long enough to grow out. Most of my failures have come in the first two weeks so I am modifying what I normally do in an attempt to get better results.

My new plan is to use rapid rooters and just place the seed in them, then place the RR in a seedling tray, put 1/4" of water in the bottom of the tray, put on a humidity dome and put all of it in the dark.

The temp in my closest varies from about 80-85*F and the relative humidity is 66% without the humidity dome. The RH jumps to 85% RH with the dome on.

Is 85*f and 85% RH too high and could this cause fungus problems? Is 66% high enough given the fact they are sitting in a 1/4" of water?

I soak my seed in a glass for 12 hrs, drop into rooter,put little piece of rooter over hole. put nxt to window, at night, under cfl

Sounds like a recipe for cooking rotten seeds.

Don't use a dome with seedlings, 66% is fine, so is 40... Seeds and seedlings do not require high air humidity level. And don't put the rapid rooters in a layer of water. Instead add a layer of perlite or hydroton, put the rapid roots on those and water them. Try to keep the temp below 80.

I too soak seeds in (warm yet cooling down) water for 12-24 hours before planting them.

And place them under light...

Sativied said:

And don't put the rapid rooters in a layer of water. Instead add a layer of perlite or hydroton, put the rapid roots on those and water them.

Click to expand...

That's a brilliant idea! I will do just that.

I read two different versions. Some same put the RR in the dark to germinate and others say put them under light. Even the Rapid Rooter tray instructions say to place them in the dark to germinate.

Why is light so important when the seed is under cover anyway?

Even though your temps are 80-85f in the space the wet RR will be colder and it will likely fluctuate. Putting light (not too strong, I use T8 ) above it helps keeps the temps in the RR stable. But besides that, if you're already have a hard time germinating, they will likely not all pop the same day and seedling that grow up in the dark become stretchy and lanky (searching for light) fast.

Soaking them addresses both of those issues. If germination fails from improper environmental settings it's usually shortly before cracking open (too much water, not enough oxygen, and/or too cold/warm) or when it just cracked. The longer that takes, the riskier it gets and the more important it becomes that the environment remain stable. Ideally you measure the inside of the RR for a complete day.

Not only that but you can try for yourself an easy experiment. I had to do it for class but we did Pinto beans and did various hypothesis and tests. Anyway, one of the hypothesis I tested was light vs no light and they were in the same enviorment, one was just in a box without light. The roots were MUCH more developed on the beans in the light...this is them sitting in a moist paper towel inside of a plastic Baggie for 7 days. Soaking them vs unsoaked was also noticible but strangely light outside vs light inside didn't have too much of a difference...and my outside temps were 90F~ while the inside was 75~

vitamin_green_inc said:

Not only that but you can try for yourself an easy experiment. I had to do it for class but we did Pinto beans and did various hypothesis and tests. Anyway, one of the hypothesis I tested was light vs no light and they were in the same enviorment, one was just in a box without light. The roots were MUCH more developed on the beans in the light...this is them sitting in a moist paper towel inside of a plastic Baggie for 7 days. Soaking them vs unsoaked was also noticible but strangely light outside vs light inside didn't have too much of a difference...and my outside temps were 90F~ while the inside was 75~

Click to expand...

My first grow was a fist fight that I lost. I was smart enough to grow more seed than I needed and finally figured out what I needed to know enough to grow and harvest a few plants. I feel like if I can get my plants to live to two weeks old, I think I'll have a good chance at finishing them.

I'm been trying to practice on bag seed and not having any luck germinating. I've order some expensive seeds and ready to try to germinate them but nervous they won't germinate.

I've tried the paper towel method a couple of different ways and that bag seed didn't crack. It could be just bad old seed but I'm not sure it's not at least partially my method.

I'm thinking as soon as the seeds break the surface in the rooter, to plant them in a cup and move them to the tent under CFL's at 12/12. The rooter won't sit in the seedling tray for more than a day after they break the surface and won't grow roots out of the rooter before they are moved.

First, I have to get them to germinate without growing fungus. Sativied's idea of putting that rooter on top of a bit of perlite wicks the moisture up without saturating the rooter is a great idea. I am testing that right now to see what kind of moisture the rooter will hold and for how long while I wait for my seeds to arrive.

If you guys say put lights over the rapid rooters to germinate, I'll do it, but it seems counter intuitive to me if seeds need dark to crack.

They don't need dark to crack. The paper towel in the Baggie trick is used by many, and there is no way a paper towel can keep light out lol.
I have left seedlings in rapid rooters for a week lol, and they will stretch like crazy but never really grow. To me the most worrisome part is actually getting them to pop above your medium...then you just feed them 0 ppm Nutes or less than 100 ppm and a proper ph and and its pretty simple?

vitamin_green_inc said:

They don't need dark to crack. The paper towel in the Baggie trick is used by many, and there is no way a paper towel can keep light out lol.
I have left seedlings in rapid rooters for a week lol, and they will stretch like crazy but never really grow. To me the most worrisome part is actually getting them to pop above your medium...then you just feed them 0 ppm Nutes or less than 100 ppm and a proper ph and and its pretty simple?

Click to expand...

Right. My problem before was all the above. No cracking, not growing. I lost more than a few to dampening off that did break the surface. That first two weeks is the toughest part to grow.

I tried a couple of different paper towel methods. Both in baggies.

One way is to leave the baggie open so it get's air. Another way is sealed. I tried both ways and once in a drawer and once in a shoe box placed on top of a cable box for added heat. None of the ways worked. I also tried using distilled water vs tap. Neither of those seem to make any difference either.

There's no question I'm having issues germinating seeds. Part of that has to be these seeds. I can't imagine it should be this difficult.

I just need to find a way that works for my situation and one that's repeatable. I don't need to know every way to grow weed, I just need to know the one way that works for me.

The rapid rooter that I placed on top of the perlite yesterday seems wet enough this morning but the temp inside the rooter is 3 degrees lower than the ambient air temp. I assume this is due to the cooling effects of the water but at 80* air temp I measured the temp inside the rooter with a meat thermometer and it was closer to 77* and that would be even less if I added a fan to the equation.

Now that I look back on it, I didn't have a good setup for seeds. I wasn't creating the right conditions like I do to grow adult plants and for seedlings those tolerances are smaller than for larger plants. If there was ever a phase that had to be well designed it has to be at the seed area. Too much or too little of everything will kill them.

I thought through the big picture, the tent etc, but didn't design and build a seed growing area or ask enough questions.

I've been looking around and found some useful info and am revising my plan to this.

Bubble up (oxygenate) some tap water to help remove chlorine. Adjust PH to about 6.0.

Soak seeds in PH'ed water 12 hours.

Place 1/2" perlite in the bottom of a seedling cup and 1/4" water in the bottom of a seedling tray.

Place a soaked seed 1/2" deep in the Rapid Rooter blunt end up (pointy end down), cover the hole with a small piece of RR and sit the Rapid Plug on top of the perlite.

Place the plug under 6500K florescent or 6500k CFL bulbs at a rate of 3w per seedling on 24/0 and keep the lights 2"- 4" from the top of the Rapid Rooter.

Place a small fan in this area to move air over the plugs and to strengthen stems.

Once the seedling breaks the surface, plant the rooter in a temporary grow cup and move it to the main CFL grow area. Grow for two weeks.

At the end of two weeks, transplant the seedlings into their final pots and move the plants to the HPS and start the nutes.


Don'ts:

Don't use 2700k to germinate seeds as this encourages stretch.

Don't use a humidity dome as this encourages fungus if your RH is already above 50%.


Do's:

Keep 1/4" of water in bottom of the seedling tray when growing seed.

Hey Earlyriser, how long did it take for your seed to germinate in the rapid rooter? I'm using something similar and it's been already three days and given my also nto too successful germination rate I'm just over thinking. I hope she sprouts tomorrow..

I have had 100% succesw using root plugs to sprout seeds so far. I use them in my bubble cloner and within 24 hours i have growing plants.

intenseneal said:

I have had 100% succesw using root plugs to sprout seeds so far. I use them in my bubble cloner and within 24 hours i have growing plants.

Click to expand...

So you just place your seed into a root plugs and 24h later you have a sprotu? Or did I miss something?

Gregor Eisenhorn said:

So you just place your seed into a root plugs and 24h later you have a sprotu? Or did I miss something?

Click to expand...

I've had 100% results with Rapid Rooters. But, they're made for cloning. The hole seems to be too large (wide/deep) for a seed. I flip it upside-down, poke my own seed-sized hole, and bury it flush in an 18-22oz seedling cup of soil. (I.e., I don't use a progragation tray). I put my cups in a tray, set it on a thermostatic heat mat set to 78-82.

az2000 said:

I've had 100% results with Rapid Rooters. But, they're made for cloning. The hole seems to be too large (wide/deep) for a seed. I flip it upside-down, poke my own seed-sized hole, and bury it flush in an 18-22oz seedling cup of soil. (I.e., I don't use a progragation tray). I put my cups in a tray, set it on a thermostatic heat mat set to 78-82.

Click to expand...

So I've heard, but I wanted to give em' a try. Should I leave the cube be or try something else? Maybe take the seed out or something?

Did you just drop the seed in the hole? Or, did you try to fill it in with material torn off the sides before adding the seed? How deep is the seed? (It may take awhile for it to reach out.). Can you see it or did you fill it with pieces after adding the seeed?

Don't let those questions motivate you to start poking around. I would leave it alone and give it up to two weeks. (There are stories of people setting a dud aside, and a week or two later it sprouts.).

I just flip them upside down and with a small screwdriver (for eyeglasses, very small) I jab a hole and tear it out a little the seed. I only plant it so it's covered 3/16 to 1/4". The clone hole the RR comes with is an inch, I think.

Ok man thanks for the tips, I'll leave it be. Next time I'll do what you did. I don't think the seed is that deep, I mean I just convered the top with a little bit of material. I hope she sprouts soon, I'm eager to try some DWC.

I use the dome with a tray inside that doesn't quite touch bottom, I fill with a little water lightly covering the bottom for humidity. Put a rapid rooter in the tray like normal, then flip the next one placing it on top of the previous only with the wide bottom down, put your seed in about the depth of the seed cover the dome. Put the dome some place it can get decent heat but not too hot, I just put it on one of my veg t5 lights and in 2 or 3 days it's popped. Since I've used this method I've not lost any seeds out of over a hundred, nor ever rotted a seed just don't soak it first.

Gregor Eisenhorn said:

I don't think the seed is that deep, I mean I just convered the top with a little bit of material.

Click to expand...

I just looked at an RR. The hole is 1" deep. It may be rooting, working it's way up. If it wasn't fully seated, the root may be growing down in free space (taking awhile to get leverage to push out). If it were fully seated, it could take awhile to grow that tall (to poke out).

I would just wait. You could lift away some of the material you put on top. But, that's usually a bad idea. If it's your first grow, it's better to resist urges like that.