To all breeders

Bobg1981 said:

Perhaps i should have explained my goal.. Im looking to produce large amounts of seeds (autoflowering) from 10 regular seeds (autos) what would be the best way in going about this to make them as stable as possible? As i look at it there are three options

1) self pollinate one female and use this pollen to pollinate the same plant
2) self pollinate and use this pollen to pollenate a female from the same batch of reg seeds
3) cross pollinate a male and female from the same batch

im not breeding to develop new strains so a bit of varience here and there is irrelevant to me. Just want to produce some seeds which i can pop fairly reliably and will produce good smoke. I had heard that the further down the lines you get with autos they become more Ruderalis and eventually end up with small plants and shit smoke.

apologies for the lack of clarity in the original post. This breeding stuff is new to me and im learning fast but its a steep curve to say the least


Appreciate your help

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To be honest it's no secret AFN is the way to go way more experience there on Autos IMO.
Autos are inconsistent even with reputable breeders who have made F4s.
1. don't do it unless you have a prized plant or for Autos you have no choice but to wait since you can't clone or keep it in veg. Since you have 10 seeds for example, veg for 2-3 weeks (or longer i think short stuff autos longer autos since they use stitch genetics made for outdoors?), discard the uglies and the slow ones.
2. Im confused why selfie anything yet if they are regs? Just pick the best 2 and lettem do incest action, do lezbeyan action later if you want fems for ease of grow.
3) yes
4) eventually you can STS 2 good fems you like and cross them to make Fem seeds.

If you're just trying to make good seeds from good genetics and don't care about variance then even better.
The best way to save time and money is to get two completely different Autos packs, growem out, STS all of them, save the pollen, mark which ones came from preferred grows, time it so you can also grow out some moms, 420 jizz them, then save the seeds from the moms that flowered nicely.
Now you have cheap seeds.
Then you grow like 10+ of these and since you dont give a shit pull the runts and ditch weed autos.

mordynyc said:

To be honest it's no secret AFN is the way to go way more experience there on Autos IMO.
Autos are inconsistent even with reputable breeders who have made F4s.
1. don't do it unless you have a prized plant or for Autos you have no choice but to wait since you can't clone or keep it in veg. Since you have 10 seeds for example, veg for 2-3 weeks (or longer i think short stuff autos longer autos since they use stitch genetics made for outdoors?), discard the uglies and the slow ones.
2. Im confused why selfie anything yet if they are regs? Just pick the best 2 and lettem do incest action, do lezbeyan action later if you want fems for ease of grow.
3) yes
4) eventually you can STS 2 good fems you like and cross them to make Fem seeds.

If you're just trying to make good seeds from good genetics and don't care about variance then even better.
The best way to save time and money is to get two completely different Autos packs, growem out, STS all of them, save the pollen, mark which ones came from preferred grows, time it so you can also grow out some moms, 420 jizz them, then save the seeds from the moms that flowered nicely.
Now you have cheap seeds.
Then you grow like 10+ of these and since you dont give a shit pull the runts and ditch weed autos.

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yeah i hear you on the prized plant, thing is its really tough to get regular auto seeds online now. Mabe they just dont bother making them as much i dont know. I came across the Onyx from short stuff because they seem to be the only ones who are producing regular auto seeds which are avaliable to me and in my price range. This was before i knew abut the possibility of buying fem seeds and reversing them. I also got a couple of big AK auto seeds from big seedbank both femmed so maybe i will experiment with crossing these two strains both the fem way and regular way.

ultimately youre right there will be a shit ton of seeds so you know im just lookng to get a few OZs for myself so its not the end of the world if i end up tossing the shite ones the only thing which restricts me is very low plant count here (basically zero) so the lower i can keep it the better. In an ideal world i could fuck around with all these different ladies and play til my hearts content but i dont want a knock at my door.

I appreciate all the hard work that breeders put in but at the same time i cant afford to fork out a shit ton of money for seeds. It seems that seedbanks are making some good coin these days

Bobg...

The reason for feminized seed really is two fold..and a bit of a win-win.

First, growers want females..Bingo. That ability, to grow a female from seed reliably is a win..

The trade off, and win for seed producer is it is slightly restrictive for breeding..Certainly easy enough to get around for capable growers...but..keeps many growers coming back to the seedbanks for more.

Hence...I wanted to breed my own potent Auto strains..Buy regular photoperiod seeds of a strain you really like, cross male pollen from those plants with the Auto females you like...Breed the offspring; creating some f2 seed from those offspring and you'll find some male Autoflowers for breeding

MrToad69 said:

Hence...I wanted to breed my own potent Auto strains..Buy regular photoperiod seeds of a strain you really like, cross male pollen from those plants with the Auto females you like...Breed the offspring; creating some f2 seed from those offspring and you'll find some male Autoflowers for breeding

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and then the resulting male autos breed with the same lineage as the original auto female? Im just thinking in terms of stabilising you know in case i get some knockout smoke

Bobg1981 said:

and then the resulting male autos breed with the same lineage as the original auto female?

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The F2 autos will go with the F2 females, creating F3 autos. But ou will still need to pheno hunt the F2s, there will still be photo periods in those seeds.
Or you can cross it back to the original Autoflower lineage

T macc said:

The F2 autos will go with the F2 females, creating F3 autos. But ou will still need to pheno hunt the F2s, there will still be photo periods in those seeds.
Or you can cross it back to the original Autoflower lineage

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thanks T im thinking this may be a long project but im up for a couple of years of playing around

2 generations is all you will need to produce an auto male...

Again, to clarify...Breed photo period male to Auto female..produce seeds..Grow out resulting seeds which will have the recessive Auto traits in all offspring ..However, heterozygous (not visible in the phenotype at this point)...You will need to grow out a bunch of these seeds...Select some qualities males to cross with females of this same generation (inbreeding) ..Approx 1/4 of the seeds from this generation will be Autoflower.

Cheers

MrToad69 said:

2 generations is all you will need to produce an auto male...

Again, to clarify...Breed photo period male to Auto female..produce seeds..Grow out resulting seeds which will have the recessive Auto traits in all offspring ..However, heterozygous (not visible in the phenotype at this point)...You will need to grow out a bunch of these seeds...Select some qualities males to cross with females of this same generation (inbreeding) ..Approx 1/4 of the seeds from this generation will be Autoflower.

Cheers

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thanks toad for clearing that up im going to play around with it so to stabilise further i would just need to interbreed between brothers and sisters each time or is it better to backcross?

T macc said:

Lol
F1 is the first generation from a male and female of differing strains. A reversed female is a female plant made into a male, but the pollen is feminized.

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Ah, thanks for the explanation. I get it now. There is still so much I need to learn.

Hey guys, I have a few questions. I have some Stardawg F2s in seed form. I'm going to make my own seed stock from male pollen and also some S1s. These seeds are already F2 from the breeder. How many generations should I breed to before I should backcross or is that even a issue? And if so could you explain how I would do that. Thanks.

FireBudzz420 said:

Hey guys, I have a few questions. I have some Stardawg F2s in seed form. I'm going to make my own seed stock from male pollen and also some S1s. These seeds are already F2 from the breeder. How many generations should I breed to before I should backcross or is that even a issue? And if so could you explain how I would do that. Thanks.

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Nothing it's all a pita not worth it and you're going to give up half way through.
Just collect clones for moms and pollen. Then recall which parents u really liked that u used ti make seeds and keep those seeds. Upto if u wanna bx or sts experiment as you wish but unless you're a collective and have space its a real commitment for some f2 stardawgs u got. What if u put in a few years on a diff strain or what if someone did this already and selling it on strainly? Then youll regret it unless its something special. Like a first auto of a popular strain never done.
Im sure someone will have exact opposite opinion.

mordynyc said:

Nothing it's all a pita not worth it and you're going to give up half way through.
Just collect clones for moms and pollen. Then recall which parents u really liked that u used ti make seeds and keep those seeds. Upto if u wanna bx or sts experiment as you wish but unless you're a collective and have space its a real commitment for some f2 stardawgs u got. What if u put in a few years on a diff strain or what if someone did this already and selling it on strainly? Then youll regret it unless its something special. Like a first auto of a popular strain never done.
Im sure someone will have exact opposite opinion.

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I considered just keeping a mother plant and STS a few clones and making 100s of S1s from her. But also my question was if I decided to cross her with another favorite strain should I just use the S1 pollen to a keeper female from the other strain? Also if the 2 strains are already stable would I need to Bx it or just let it roll? Thanks

mordynyc said:

Nothing it's all a pita not worth it and you're going to give up half way through.
Just collect clones for moms and pollen. Then recall which parents u really liked that u used ti make seeds and keep those seeds. Upto if u wanna bx or sts experiment as you wish but unless you're a collective and have space its a real commitment for some f2 stardawgs u got. What if u put in a few years on a diff strain or what if someone did this already and selling it on strainly? Then youll regret it unless its something special. Like a first auto of a popular strain never done.
Im sure someone will have exact opposite opinion.

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You're correct.

I just started some F4's. I've been working on this for awhile. It does take time. I'm not concerned about anyone having done it already. In fact Tropical Seeds has a Durbakistan which is the same cross but their seeds are F1's. I'm going all the way to a new P1. It's just a goal of mine. I probably won't do it again with any other crosses I make.

xtsho said:

You're correct.

I just started some F4's. I've been working on this for awhile. It does take time. I'm not concerned about anyone having done it already. In fact Tropical Seeds has a Durbakistan which is the same cross but their seeds are F1's. I'm going all the way to a new P1. It's just a goal of mine. I probably won't do it again with any other crosses I make.

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Good luck man that's some interesting shit right there.

Generally speaking, you'll have a lot more success locking in desired traits by continuing to cross forward and making good selections than by backcrossing.

Hawg Wild said:

Generally speaking, you'll have a lot more success locking in desired traits by continuing to cross forward and making good selections than by backcrossing.

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That's what I was thinking. Thanks.