SIP thread -- (Sub-Irrigated Planter)

Tim Fox

Tim Fox

Well-Known Member
This happens in everyone of my sip grows with the air gap , the roots grow long and Jump the air gap and grow down into the res forming water roots Not thru the wick ( although that also happens) so if there was any truth to air pruning this would not happen but picturesand my eyes don't lie , there has to be holes in the floor and the floor has to be over the res for this to workIMG_5261.jpg
 
Tim Fox

Tim Fox

Well-Known Member
[QUOTE="sandhill larry, post: 13584135, member: 9469ourselvesout ng at some other RGGS videos, many folks drill holes in the buckets, then line them with landscape fabric. That gives you the advantages of air pruning. The holes were in the sides of the buckets though, not the bottom.[/QUOTE]
If we line the floor with landscape fabric we cheat ourselves out of the hydroponics action and you end up with just a self wateringplanter and that is only half of what we can do with these
 
T-Time

T-Time

Well-Known Member
hello to everyone :)
Just finished reading the whole thread. Loads of great info.
I think I will give it a go on my next round with that rain gutter. I have already AirPots, which should be ideal for this application as they have plenty of holes in bottom part and it has adjustable height.

Not sure about the nutes/soil yet as I had great success with Bio-Bizz range and not really keen on cooking my own soil, so I think I'll go with nutes to the rez in RDWC style for the first run. I'll have to go recilculating anyways as I'll be running two gutters, one above the other.

What do You guys think? Will it work ?
 
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Tim Fox

Tim Fox

Well-Known Member
In this picture you can see the wick on the leftand the right, but notice all the roots that were not air pruned and jumped the gap and into the res this provides hempy bucket type growth becausethe roots not only get fresh air from the gap but now are also hydroponics roots so it's the best of soil and hydroponics in one we deny ourselves this benefit if we don't drill holes in the floor or if we just set a bucketin water or if we try and stop the roots with burlap or root block fabricGrow-box-Sept.jpg Grow-box-Sept.jpg
 
Tim Fox

Tim Fox

Well-Known Member
sandhill larry said:
I'm not saying the RGGS is as good or better than SIP, just that it is an easy way to grow, and some of you might be interested in it. I don't let a possible great keep me from enjoying good. Right now I catch rainwater with tarps, then carry it in five gallon buckets to my patches.
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Plenty of info about ways to automatically water gardens and they are all fun , but what make octopot, Hempybucket, grow box and earth box and. The homemade sips from others work like hydro is the res under gap with roots having accessto the res , some even go so far as to ad air stones , I wanted to post those pictures to show others what really goes on underneath
 
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ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Tim Fox said:
Plenty of info about ways to automatically water gardens and they are all fun , but what make octopot, Hempybucket, grow box and earth box and. The homemade sips from others work like hydro is the res under gap with roots having accessto the res , some even go so far as to ad air stones , I wanted to post those pictures to show others what really goes on underneath
Click to expand...
The pics were very helpful.

Root pruning happens if the roots grow out of a container into the open, finding light and dry air. That's not the case inside the container so they drop through the holes and hit the water.

You're suggesting I drill holes in my tubs. Currently the only hole fits the netpot wick.

Easy enough to do.
 
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Tim Fox

Tim Fox

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
The pics were very helpful.

Sir pruning happens if the roots for out of a container into the open, finding light and dry air. That's not the case inside the container so they drop through the holes and hit the water.

You're suggesting I drill holes in my tubs. Currently the only hole fits the netpot wick.

Easy enough to do.
Click to expand...
so, when the roots pass thru the holes under the soil ( not the wick),, are the roots not in the open?,, people say that roots "air prune" inside of a cloth grow bag, but yet the roots never were exposed to the oustide? inside the sip as the roots pass thru the bottom plate under the soil the roots are exposed to air and lots of it, the roots then have to then pass thru 1" of air space Before they hit the res water level,
So by your definition the roots should have air pruned,, but they dont,, like in the photos above

i have never seen your tubs,, so i cant really comment on what you have going on,,
 
Humanrob

Humanrob

Well-Known Member
Tim Fox said:
...we deny ourselves this benefit if we don't drill holes in the floor...
Click to expand...
For one of my grows last winter I made two kinds of sips, a pair with 3 gallon bins over 3 gallon bins (those had holes), and a pair with 3 gallon fabric pots over 3 gallon bins (no holes other than the wick). Both produced water roots equally well. The last pic is of my current grow, which is a fabric pot over the res, no holes in the bottom, lots of roots in the water... just sayin'...

pair-of-3gal.JPG 3over3-3gal.JPG fabric-3gal.JPG water-roots.JPG

It is possible that the additional holes create additional opportunities for the plant to drop roots through, but mine have rooted through the wick. It's also possible that this only works with air stones -- I've always used them so I have no point of comparison without them. Actually, now that I think about it, in my first SIP grow I had the holes all over the bottom, and and the ONLY water roots I had were growing in a column above where the air stone was, which happened to be where the fill tube was (all the roots grew through the crack around the tube, not the wick or the holes per se). Anyway, that's why I've used air stones ever since.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Tim Fox said:
so, when the roots pass thru the holes under the soil ( not the wick),, are the roots not in the open?,, people say that roots "air prune" inside of a cloth grow bag, but yet the roots never were exposed to the oustide? inside the sip as the roots pass thru the bottom plate under the soil the roots are exposed to air and lots of it, the roots then have to then pass thru 1" of air space Before they hit the res water level,
So by your definition the roots should have air pruned,, but they dont,, like in the photos above

i have never seen your tubs,, so i cant really comment on what you have going on,,
Click to expand...
Those roots are still inside the larger container which has water in it. The air space the roots encounter is therefore dark and humid, so no root pruning happens.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Tim Fox said:
well crap,, i lost that one,, @ttystikk you win
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This isn't a competition! Clearly, you plants are winning so you are certainly no loser, lol

I've had great luck with pumping water through a nozzle above the waterline and then recirculating it back through a control bucket with a pump in it. RDWC with no air pump at all.

I'm going to try something similar with SIPS, in the hope that sufficient water flow, churning action and oxygenation will accomplish the same result with less effort in terms of cooling the water or needing airstones.
 
Evil-Mobo

Evil-Mobo

Well-Known Member
I tried air stones in the past in my 5 gallon sips and.really saw no difference compared to no stone I'm fine with my 5 gallon bucket setups for reasons previously mentioned myself just looking to not have to water as often.

@Humanrob your containers with the fabric pots basically looks like an octo pot setup and I have considered this as well because I have a few pots lying around just not sure what benefit if any it would provide over the current setup which is why I hadn't ordered an octo pot yet to begin with .......

Lots of ways to skin a cat and it's nice to be able to bounce ideas off of folks like we are here.

My main thing is just to be able to incorporate and gravity fed res to the bucket or other style sip if I could soon to not have to water as often.

That's why the design with the rain gutter appealed to me. I was thinking I could setup two smaller rows of gutters with bracing between them to shape an I if you will and them I could freely run one or two buckets per gutter depending on what I was doing with the grow. I'm also doing a scrog for the first time this grow and really liking it so far so it would be nice not to have to get under the canopy to access the fill tubes and instead just mess with a res outside the tent feeding my system with water.........
 
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PDX Joe

PDX Joe

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
The pics were very helpful.

Root pruning happens if the roots grow out of a container into the open, finding light and dry air. That's not the case inside the container so they drop through the holes and hit the water.

You're suggesting I drill holes in my tubs. Currently the only hole fits the netpot wick.

Easy enough to do.
Click to expand...
Yeah, drill the holes. It won't hurt and I do think it helps.
 
PDX Joe

PDX Joe

Well-Known Member
T-Time said:
hello to everyone :)
Just finished reading the whole thread. Loads of great info.
I think I will give it a go on my next round with that rain gutter. I have already AirPots, which should be ideal for this application as they have plenty of holes in bottom part and it has adjustable height.

Not sure about the nutes/soil yet as I had great success with Bio-Bizz range and not really keen on cooking my own soil, so I think I'll go with nutes to the rez in RDWC style for the first run. I'll have to go recilculating anyways as I'll be running two gutters, one above the other.

What do You guys think? Will it work ?
Click to expand...
I don't cook my soil. I just add dry organic nutes and compost to the top of the soil. In the past I have supplemented with liquid nutrients in the reservoir. But, I'm moving away from this practice. I do add microbes to help break down the fertilizer for the plants.
 
T-Time

T-Time

Well-Known Member
PDX Joe said:
I don't cook my soil. I just add dry organic nutes and compost to the top of the soil. In the past I have supplemented with liquid nutrients in the reservoir. But, I'm moving away from this practice. I do add microbes to help break down the fertilizer for the plants.
Click to expand...
I'm still hesitate what to do with the nutes. I would rather stay with what I know wokrs best (obviously) but on the other hand like to experiment a lot in my zen garden :)

I've seen photos of Your plants and they seem healthy. Any chance You could share Your mix ? I prabobly missed that.
Are You adding anything mid run ?
 
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