War

Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
StonedGardener

StonedGardener

Well-Known Member
Man I'm getting so fucking pissed-off as we watch that psychopath ( possibly sociopath) Putin in action. Sure , everybody's trying to help , but we sit an watch an apocalypse in real time. This insidious , true evil more than likely will have to be confronted at some point in time. Perhaps he can gobble up and annihilate all the non-NATO countries and citizens , but don't piss him off about it.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
StonedGardener said:
Man I'm getting so fucking pissed-off as we watch that psychopath ( possibly sociopath) Putin in action. Sure , everybody's trying to help , but we sit an watch an apocalypse in real time. This insidious , true evil more than likely will have to be confronted at some point in time. Perhaps he can gobble up and annihilate all the non-NATO countries and citizens , but don't piss him off about it.
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I completely agree.

Not giving voice to the nutjobs, trolls or agents posting crap about "bad 'merica because Cuba so why be mad about Ukraine now?" and other lunacy. But your post caused me to turn the mirror around and imagine this is how people looked upon the US when we went into Vietnam or overstayed in Afghanistan by about 18 years too long or sent drone strikes that killed civilians. As a person who lives in the US and have always been ashamed of those actions I never saw it from with an outsider's perspective.

Not trying to equate anything with Putin's inhumanity. Just sharing a recent shift in my perspective.

All indications are that Russia will not prosper from this action, nor will he be able to hold Ukraine, much less invade other countries ever again. I don't think this is going to end well or any time soon unless Vlad goes nuclear. But then again, I didn't think Putin would invade, so I'm not predicting anything, just preparing for the worst.
 
S

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
StonedGardener said:
Man I'm getting so fucking pissed-off as we watch that psychopath ( possibly sociopath) Putin in action. Sure , everybody's trying to help , but we sit an watch an apocalypse in real time. This insidious , true evil more than likely will have to be confronted at some point in time. Perhaps he can gobble up and annihilate all the non-NATO countries and citizens , but don't piss him off about it.
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My thoughts:

The United States is not putting boots on the ground in Ukraine. Period. Full stop.

This us a NATO Operation..where's the UN and their little jeeps with white flags?

"Close the sky"..who is Zelensky talking to? Ukraine is not a NATO country and there are rules.

Putin is looking for a reason..don't give it to him..you know in the end he's going to twist something around and use that as the excuse.

If they want to close the skies why do they need planes?

I don't understand why Putin id making Eastern Ukraine into a 'no mans land'. Why?
 
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Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
Bagginski said:
My friend, it occurs to me that “we” (in the largest sense) may have been looking at this all wrong:

I thought Beau’s point about the possibility that Putin is sandbagging the west - embarking on a “Potemkin invasion” intended to claim Ukraine, yes, but aimed at convincing the West that Russia’s military is a crew of beat-down homeless guys, raising the outrage of the EU, drawing more involvement by NATO, then springing their newest, greatest, fastest, etc and literally defeating Europe and the US with weapons and vehicles we know nothing about.

It may not be likely, but it needs to be thought about
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Beau is a pretty reliable source of good information, and he may very well have a point, but...did they go so far as to fake shitty logistics? they didn't have enough food, or fuel, or information, or warning...they've lost 2 field general, several officers, and a lot of equipment, even if it wasn't all top of the line gear. if it is a potemkin village, then they've tromp l'oeil'ed the hell out of it.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Roger A. Shrubber said:
that seemed like good news, right up till the end...i don't know if Biden or any of the EU leaders will back off of sanctions till putin has at least withdrawn all troops...
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You know how it is with the Chinese government. Shifts in policy are communicated incrementally. China watchers are astonished Xi used the word "war". As I said, cracks starting to show.

It's behind a pay wall so I won't post it here. Financial Times based in London reports anecdotes from Chinese companies that European companies are cancelling orders because of Chinese government's support for Russia. Other factors are also biting into an already destabilized Chinese economy:

  • 70% of its oil is imported and the cost per barrel has risen 20% from $100/barrel to $120/barrel.
  • 40% of LNG is imported and cost for it has jumped
  • Heavy rains inside China caused the worst winter wheat harvest in that country's history. Wheat imports into China are expected to go up 50% this year. Wheat prices have jumped due to the expected loss of Ukrainian wheat production.
  • Iron ore contracts have gone up 25%
  • Worldwide supply chains, already disrupted by the pandemic are disrupted by the conflict. China depends on shipping to get its products to customers.

Yes, the US is affected by similar issues but China is much more vulnerable to these issues. Inflation is going to hit China hard. Banks were already reeling from a self inflicted real estate crisis and now it appears the Chinese economy's growth rate will slow even more than it did during the pandemic with rising inflation. Stagflation.

Probably more concerning to Xi is how their stance alongside Russia affects China's geopolitical goals. A major goal of the modern day Chinese government is become a military and economic superpower that makes the world safe for state capitalist, authoritarian regimes. The conflict in Ukraine has caused democracies to pivot away from countries like that, including China. The announcement last month of an agreement to have closer ties with Russia give Xi and his regime a very bad look. Reputational damage is inevitable and they have no good answer for their apparent lack of knowledge that Putin was going to invade. He can't say he knew before Putin invaded without further harming international relations and he can't say he didn't know without losing his image at home as an all knowing, all-seeing commanding leader.

Cracks in their relationship might be nothing but there are reasons to think they indicate an underlying weakness that causes changes in the Sino-Russian relationship.
 
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