All Power To The Post Office ...

ViRedd

New Member
All Power to the Post Office

By Richard E. Ralston
June 12, 2007


The U.S. government now pays for and controls half of the health care in America. That is up from less than 10 percent forty years ago. Government spending on health care has increased at a rapid rate as its share of health care has increased. Yet those who complain about the total amount of spending on health care in the United States to justify complete government control never discuss how much of the current spending is attributable to or mandated by government programs.

During a recent interview, a talk radio host told me that all private health insurance should be eliminated in order to give us all a reason to work together to make sure the government runs a good health care system.

My first reaction to that statement was to question how that approach has been working for public education. But I will come back to that. A better analogy would be that conditions in our prisons might be expected to improve if we were all required to live in them. Socialists and some Liberals would find this level of government-enforced uniformity to be a noble sacrifice to which all citizens must submit. Many Conservatives would reluctantly agree—but suggest a voucher system that would allow us each to select the prison cell of our choice.

The same reasoning would require the government to outlaw Federal Express, UPS and other private carriers, and force everyone to use the U.S. Postal Service exclusively. After all, Americans are now spending more than the citizens of any other country on package delivery. Even worse, poor people cannot afford to send anyone a FedEx package. Why allow rich people to have access to a better package delivery system? Would it not be simple social justice to require everyone to use the U.S. Postal Service? So what if it provides slower and less reliable service? Would not everyone be forced to band together to ensure that USPS does a better job?

Of course, we tried that for nearly 200 years when postmasters were politically appointed as a part of a federal spoils system. The Postal Reorganization Act of 1971 created the U.S. Postal Service as a semi-independent agency with less political interference. That plus only limited competition, in the likes of FedEx and UPS, was enough to cause the U.S. Postal Service to improve its efficiency and reliability considerably. What would be the consequences of eliminating that competition and restoring a total government monopoly? Would the U. S. Postal Service become better and cheaper?

Parents certainly have reason to band together to improve the near-monopoly of public education. They can exercise control only through politicians who often place their own interests—or those of public employee unions—ahead of those of students. Heads of unions, vying for political pull, use mandatory contributions deducted from teacher salaries to place their interests in the front of the line—ahead of students and parents. The leaders of those unions, who may spend hundreds of millions of dollars for contributions to politicians, maintain, of course, that their only concern is the welfare of the little children. Imagine for a moment what the power of a national physicians union or a national nurses union would do to health care, or imagine the prospect of a national health care strike. The only objective of these unions would be better health care for you, and for the children, right?

There are those who tell us that if we only place all of our trust in the government to control our health care, our problems will be solved. If only enlightened intellectuals ensure that each and every election puts their candidates for President and Congress in control, efficient and loving government will meet all of our medical needs. We all have surely learned that government always does a good job, and has a swell record at keeping down unnecessary expenses.

What would really happen if we had no options except government health care and no place else to go? What choice did wounded soldiers at Walter Reed Army Medical Center have? If this happened right under the nose of Congress—indeed in view of the windows of the VIP suites at the hospital reserved for Cabinet members and Congressmen—what kind of quality and oversight should the rest of us expect from a government system?

One of the things that helps curtail the inferior standards that exist in government health care is a comparison with services provided by private medical care. Such private care must be protected. Without it the 50 percent of care now paid for by the government would get much worse.

Collectivism does not work. The immoral use of government force cannot compel better health care. Putting us all in a government health care prison will not ensure better health care. Only freedom can do that.

Richard E. Ralston is Executive Director of Americans for Free Choice in Medicine.
 

Garden Knowm

The Love Doctor
i did not read the entire post... well.. i read a few sentences... :)

how has the increase in health care (savong lives) compare to the increase in defense (art of killing people)...


seems like neither is working... but is there a lesser of to FOOK UPS?
 

medicineman

New Member
Richard E. Ralston
Specialties: Ayn Rand's life, Objectivism (General), Projects of the Ayn Rand Institute, Volunteerism, Foreign Policy, Journalism and Media
After serving seven years in the U.S. Army, Mr. Ralston completed an M.A. in International Relations at the University of Southern California in 1977. He then began a career in newspaper publishing and direct marketing. He has been the circulation director and publisher of The Christian Science Monitor, a radio producer, a national television news business manager, and a book publisher. As an independent direct marketing consultant, his clients included IBM, British Airways, CNN, and the Los Angeles Times. His book Communism: Its Rise and Fall in the 20th Century was published in 1991. He edited the book Why Businessmen Need Philosophy in 1999, and was the revision editor of two books by Ayn Rand in 2005: Three Plays and The Early Ayn Rand. He is the Publishing Manager of the Ayn Rand Institute.


Enough said
 

ViRedd

New Member
Odd ... no mention of the article itself, Med? Come on Big Boy, tear it apart. ~lol~

Vi
 

medicineman

New Member
Odd ... no mention of the article itself, Med? Come on Big Boy, tear it apart. ~lol~

Vi
Not worth my time, VI, this is pure rhetoric and a viperous attack on socialized medicine, No need to refute it, its pure conjecture from a raving Ann Rand lunatic. You have your views and I have mine, I'm only glad you only have one vote, I'll cancel it out for ya.
 

ViRedd

New Member
Med ...

How about this paragraph? Should we have a government takeover of the delivery businesses?


The same reasoning would require the government to outlaw Federal Express, UPS and other private carriers, and force everyone to use the U.S. Postal Service exclusively. After all, Americans are now spending more than the citizens of any other country on package delivery. Even worse, poor people cannot afford to send anyone a FedEx package. Why allow rich people to have access to a better package delivery system? Would it not be simple social justice to require everyone to use the U.S. Postal Service? So what if it provides slower and less reliable service? Would not everyone be forced to band together to ensure that USPS does a better job?
 

7xstall

Well-Known Member
what if my car needed a new headlight, should i dispose of it at the mechanics shop and go buy a whole new car with new lights? i hear they do sell replacement head lights... hmm.






.
 

closet.cult

New Member
Richard E. Ralston
Specialties: Ayn Rand's life, Objectivism (General), Projects of the Ayn Rand Institute, Volunteerism, Foreign Policy, Journalism and Media
After serving seven years in the U.S. Army, Mr. Ralston completed an M.A. in International Relations at the University of Southern California in 1977. He then began a career in newspaper publishing and direct marketing. He has been the circulation director and publisher of The Christian Science Monitor, a radio producer, a national television news business manager, and a book publisher. As an independent direct marketing consultant, his clients included IBM, British Airways, CNN, and the Los Angeles Times. His book Communism: Its Rise and Fall in the 20th Century was published in 1991. He edited the book Why Businessmen Need Philosophy in 1999, and was the revision editor of two books by Ayn Rand in 2005: Three Plays and The Early Ayn Rand. He is the Publishing Manager of the Ayn Rand Institute.


Enough said
med: what have you got against ayn rand? i see you copy/pasting this same note on the author like its a bad thing that he likes ayn rand.

ayn rand escaped from communistic russia and loved american freedom and wrote intelligent books about the pitfalls of socialistc trappings. what is your complaint with that?
 

medicineman

New Member
Med ...

How about this paragraph? Should we have a government takeover of the delivery businesses?


The same reasoning would require the government to outlaw Federal Express, UPS and other private carriers, and force everyone to use the U.S. Postal Service exclusively. After all, Americans are now spending more than the citizens of any other country on package delivery. Even worse, poor people cannot afford to send anyone a FedEx package. Why allow rich people to have access to a better package delivery system? Would it not be simple social justice to require everyone to use the U.S. Postal Service? So what if it provides slower and less reliable service? Would not everyone be forced to band together to ensure that USPS does a better job?
That is why I discount the author, his warped reasoning. We have UPS and Fedex, and everythying gets taken care of just like it would in a government run Medical plan. You rich dicks could still have your outrageously priced medical care and pay through the nose, while the rest of us would have something akin to VA medical. Hey, let private enterprise roll. I think it would work it'self out when the outpriced DR.s found out half their patients were going to government care, they would either Join, or raise their prices to capture only the rich dicks, since there aren't that many rich pricks, they would probably be forced to join up. In most 1st world countries that have government medical, DR.s make the equivalent of about $250,000 a year, a pretty fair income.
 

closet.cult

New Member
That is why I discount the author, his warped reasoning. We have UPS and Fedex, and everythying gets taken care of just like it would in a government run Medical plan. You rich dicks could still have your outrageously priced medical care and pay through the nose, while the rest of us would have something akin to VA medical. Hey, let private enterprise roll. I think it would work it'self out when the outpriced DR.s found out half their patients were going to government care, they would either Join, or raise their prices to capture only the rich dicks, since there aren't that many rich pricks, they would probably be forced to join up. In most 1st world countries that have government medical, DR.s make the equivalent of about $250,000 a year, a pretty fair income.
man, that's not the idea i got from the article at all. ups is slightly higher then usps but damn not that more! haven't you sent a package recently. post office is way overpriced for the package getting there a week later then ups.

free enterprise, capitalism, handling any industry always brings the cost down, due to competition. so where's your complaint?
 

medicineman

New Member
man, that's not the idea i got from the article at all. ups is slightly higher then usps but damn not that more! haven't you sent a package recently. post office is way overpriced for the package getting there a week later then ups.

free enterprise, capitalism, handling any industry always brings the cost down, due to competition. so where's your complaint?
My complaint is there is no USPS in the medical field, If there were then you rich dicks could go to the Fedex of medical or the UPS of medical and everyone would be happy, except the HMOs and the overpriced for profit Insurance companies that have to pay all those stockholders and that CEO those millions in profits.
 

closet.cult

New Member
My complaint is there is no USPS in the medical field, If there were then you rich dicks could go to the Fedex of medical or the UPS of medical and everyone would be happy, except the HMOs and the overpriced for profit Insurance companies that have to pay all those stockholders and that CEO those millions in profits.
you can't even follow a train of logical thought.

a) i am not rich, but know enough about money to know that socialism will be the demise of any country.

b) there is a USPS in the medical field, dick. this article plainly says the government is in control of 50% of the medical industry. and look what happens, prices for services skyrocket; like everything else when government gets involved and holds the monopoly. on the opposite coin, when free enterprise is allowed in an industry, the prices reduce due to competition. (an added bonus is the money goes into the hands of the people, not the government.)

are you looking for a free handout, med? fine, but if thats the case, you and I and all americans will pay 4 to 5 times what every proceedure and every service really costs. and then you wonder why democrats need to raise taxes. oh i forgot you don't pay taxes. well, that explains everything now, doesn't it.
 

ViRedd

New Member
The Bankruptcy of Medicare
April 27, 2004
Anthony Gregory


At the end of last year George W. Bush signed the Medicare Modernization Act of 2003 into law in the name of “honoring the commitments of Medicare to all our seniors.” The bulk of the law provided prescription drug subsidies for the elderly, at an estimated cost of between $400 billion and more than $1 trillion over the next decade. Less than four months later, the Medicare’s Board of Trustees issued a report citing Bush’s subsidy as a major reason that the program would go bankrupt by 2019, seven years earlier than the board predicted last year.

As far as sound economics go, Medicare has really been bankrupt since it began in 1965. Since its inception, virtually every reform intended to fix it and keep it afloat has increased medical costs, decreased health care quality for the elderly, and created problems that politicians would use as excuses to pass new reforms.

Government health insurance for the elderly did not have its debut in America, but rather in Prussia in 1883 under the authoritarian regime of Otto von Bismarck. Bismarck invented mandatory health insurance and social security to keep his subjects subservient and dependent, to prevent the more leftist socialists from gaining popular support, and to help cover the costs of the Franco-Prussian War through payroll taxes masked as retirement savings accounts. His legacy had a huge impact worldwide at the turn of the century, as many countries began adopting similar programs.

Because of the high costs and un-American socialism associated with government health insurance, it took more than half a century for its American supporters to implement it in the United States. It finally happened under Lyndon Johnson’s Great Society in 1965, after congressional Republicans and Democrats finally agreed to combine their competing health insurance programs into one gigantic package called “Medicare.”

In its first year, Medicare payments totaled $1 billion, but by 1971, the payments had already risen to $7.9 billion annually. Congress was surprised by the ballooning costs of health care services, and held hearings and established commissions to fix the problem, the first of several failed attempts.

In 1973, Congress passed the Health Maintenance Organizations Act to deal with Medicare’s exploding cost and to otherwise help workers with their rising health insurance premiums. The law subsidized HMOs, forcing employers to offer the programs to workers. Years later, many would complain that the government-fostered HMO leviathan had become too powerful and bureaucratic and called on the government to step in and fix the problem.

To reduce the amount spent on heath care, Congress passed legislation to limit the construction of hospitals in 1974, and in the early 1980s it established new regulations limiting the length of hospital stays for Medicare patients.

In order to combat the growing problem of Medicare fraud (estimated in 1996 to cost $18 billion annually) Congress included in the 1996 Health Insurance Act criminal and civil penalties for doctors who filled out paperwork incorrectly, or who filed claims for treatments “not medically necessary”—as retroactively determined by the Department of Health and Human Services. Under current law, doctors can face jail time if they provide treatments uncovered by Medicare, even if their patients wish to pay out of pocket for such services.

Even with seven payroll tax hikes in twenty-one years, anti-“fraud” regulations, and other reforms, Medicare is still a disaster. Despite a $150 billion annual Medicare budget, today’s elderly now spend more than twice as much out of pocket than they did before Medicare was enacted, even after accounting for inflation. Seniors who try to circumvent the system by opting out of Medicare altogether must forego all Social Security benefits. Medicare has become morally, as well as fiscally, bankrupt.

The price of healthcare for the elderly has continued to increase, even as Congress passed more and more reforms, further inundating doctors with paperwork and new regulations, and increasing payroll taxes for workers.

Prescription drugs have been especially expensive for seniors, mostly due to the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), which forces drug companies to spend hundreds of billions of dollars to test their drugs before releasing them onto the market, even when such drugs are freely available and safely used in Europe. In order to recoup these costs, pharmaceutical companies must charge exorbitant prices. In the meantime, far more deaths result from the FDA keeping drugs off the market than lives saved from this “protection.”

To “repair” these government-induced health care problems, Bush signed the largest expansion of Medicare since its establishment in 1965. Bush claims that the new plan will save the elderly money, even as Medicare is headed straight for bankruptcy. However, just like all the reforms in the years between, it will fail. Neither small reforms nor huge spending increases will fix the underlying problem. As long as government subsidizes healthcare, prices will rise to whatever the government is willing to pay, taxpayers will suffer, and the elderly will still be left out. Even as Medicare demonstrates the abject failure of government health care, some believe the answer is to extend the program, and nationalize medicine for all of us.

After half a century of effort, Medicare’s proponents finally implemented their beloved program when the healthcare for seniors had never been better. Before the establishment of Medicare and the increased powers of the FDA in the 1960s, America did not have a health care crisis, the nation’s young were insured, and the elderly had easier access to the newest available drugs. Hospital stays were cheaper and doctors did house calls. If Bush were as “compassionate” as he claims, he would work to scrap the morally and economically bankrupt Medicare scam, lift the regulations that keep affordable life-saving drugs from those in need, and restore the relatively free market in medicine that America had before Bismarck’s crooked scheme achieved bipartisan popularity and began undercutting the best healthcare system in the world.
Anthony Gregory
Send email

Anthony Gregory is a Research Analyst at The Independent Institute. He earned his bachelor's degree in American history from the University of California at Berkeley and gave the undergraduate history commencement speech in 2003. In addition to his work with the Independent Institute, he regularly writes for numerous news and commentary web sites, including LewRockwell.com, Future of Freedom Foundation, and the Rational Review.
Full Biography and Recent Publications
 

medicineman

New Member
you can't even follow a train of logical thought.

a) i am not rich, but know enough about money to know that socialism will be the demise of any country.

b) there is a USPS in the medical field, dick. this article plainly says the government is in control of 50% of the medical industry. and look what happens, prices for services skyrocket; like everything else when government gets involved and holds the monopoly. on the opposite coin, when free enterprise is allowed in an industry, the prices reduce due to competition. (an added bonus is the money goes into the hands of the people, not the government.)

are you looking for a free handout, med? fine, but if thats the case, you and I and all americans will pay 4 to 5 times what every proceedure and every service really costs. and then you wonder why democrats need to raise taxes. oh i forgot you don't pay taxes. well, that explains everything now, doesn't it.
How many times must I explain how wonderful the SS and VA work, both government agencies. I see that you are a right wing dork, so arguement is useless. I will enjoy my government hand outs as you call them, although I did my Viet Nam service for VA and Paid into SS for 50+ years. Wring your hands and wail, I'll Be gettin my Govment cheeze for another 20 or so years with a little luck. Who knows, maybe my meager investments will even pay off and I can live like you and VI,~LOL~. Don't cry for me. I live rather well. I don't have to get out of bed If I don't want to, and still make enough to live on, I wonder how all you working guys can sit on a computer at work and play on the net, I'll bet your bosses wouldn't like that much unless you are the boss.
 

closet.cult

New Member
How many times must I explain how wonderful the SS and VA work, both government agencies. I see that you are a right wing dork, so arguement is useless. I will enjoy my government hand outs as you call them, although I did my Viet Nam service for VA and Paid into SS for 50+ years. Wring your hands and wail, I'll Be gettin my Govment cheeze for another 20 or so years with a little luck. Who knows, maybe my meager investments will even pay off and I can live like you and VI,~LOL~. Don't cry for me. I live rather well. I don't have to get out of bed If I don't want to, and still make enough to live on, I wonder how all you working guys can sit on a computer at work and play on the net, I'll bet your bosses wouldn't like that much unless you are the boss.
med, i have no problem with the government giving you now what you deserved for the service you preformed. but i think your dollars and mine would go further if the system of health care were reformed.

but then again, i'm no expert on national heath care options. somehow i doubt you are either. so don't act like your ideas came down from mount sinai. we could both be wrong, this is just a discussion.
 

medicineman

New Member
med, i have no problem with the government giving you now what you deserved for the service you preformed. but i think your dollars and mine would go further if the system of health care were reformed.

but then again, i'm no expert on national heath care options. somehow i doubt you are either. so don't act like your ideas came down from mount sinai. we could both be wrong, this is just a discussion.

For the sake of discussion, Why don't we give the government a chance to prove it would work better than "for Profit" medical. Doesn't that seem like an oxymoron, Medical care for profit. I'm all for Doctors Getting paid, but hospitals with stockholders, Insurance companies with stockholders and HMOs with stockholders is a giant rip-off period. Medical insurance should go the way of the horse, they outlived their legitimacy when they priced themselves out of the market and published the salaries of their CEOs, whoops, the profit is now what it's all about. HMOs are exactly opposite of what is needed for medical, "Let's see Mr. jones, We know you need that kidney transplant to live, but it isn't on our formulary list" "so die motherfucker, die", and hospitals that charge 9.50 for a fucking aspirin so the CEOs can walk with million dollar salaries are dinosaurs. Heres's the deal, take the profit out of medical and I don't care who runs it, maybe then a kidney transplant would be on the list, not being traded off for a new porsche.
 

closet.cult

New Member
For the sake of discussion, Why don't we give the government a chance to prove it would work better than "for Profit" medical. Doesn't that seem like an oxymoron, Medical care for profit. I'm all for Doctors Getting paid, but hospitals with stockholders, Insurance companies with stockholders and HMOs with stockholders is a giant rip-off period. Medical insurance should go the way of the horse, they outlived their legitimacy when they priced themselves out of the market and published the salaries of their CEOs, whoops, the profit is now what it's all about. HMOs are exactly opposite of what is needed for medical, "Let's see Mr. jones, We know you need that kidney transplant to live, but it isn't on our formulary list" "so die motherfucker, die", and hospitals that charge 9.50 for a fucking aspirin so the CEOs can walk with million dollar salaries are dinosaurs. Heres's the deal, take the profit out of medical and I don't care who runs it, maybe then a kidney transplant would be on the list, not being traded off for a new porsche.
alright. i understand. but doesn't government run programs usually generate alot of waste? not to mention that after it's in place for a while corruption runs rampant by those who get money from the people instead of for profit buisnesses who have to account for losses or go out of buisness.

that's my main concern about handing over medical care to the government.

wait! an even bigger concern is big brother having an enormous foot in the door of our privacy. our 'medical information will be so handy on out real i.d. cards', so says the assholes who want to tag us with implanted i.d.'s like cattle.
 

ViRedd

New Member
For the sake of discussion, Why don't we give the government a chance to prove it would work better than "for Profit" medical. Doesn't that seem like an oxymoron, Medical care for profit. I'm all for Doctors Getting paid, but hospitals with stockholders, Insurance companies with stockholders and HMOs with stockholders is a giant rip-off period. Medical insurance should go the way of the horse, they outlived their legitimacy when they priced themselves out of the market and published the salaries of their CEOs, whoops, the profit is now what it's all about. HMOs are exactly opposite of what is needed for medical, "Let's see Mr. jones, We know you need that kidney transplant to live, but it isn't on our formulary list" "so die motherfucker, die", and hospitals that charge 9.50 for a fucking aspirin so the CEOs can walk with million dollar salaries are dinosaurs. Heres's the deal, take the profit out of medical and I don't care who runs it, maybe then a kidney transplant would be on the list, not being traded off for a new porsche.
???? Did you read the article I posted, Med?? Its chock full of FACTS pointing out that government IS ... IS ... IS the problem. Do you honestly believe government needs "another chance?" ~lol~

Vi
 

medicineman

New Member
???? Did you read the article I posted, Med?? Its chock full of FACTS pointing out that government IS ... IS ... IS the problem. Do you honestly believe government needs "another chance?" ~lol~

Vi
YES!..............That article was probably comprised of rumors and bullshit distributed by the elites that control the for profit medical system that has the American public in so much fear about government medical. You'll notice, It's not those senators that are for national medical, they have a wonderful plan and fuck us. I've always maintained that you could keep your medical VI, I'd just like to see everyone else have a plan, one payed for by taxes and strangled of profit. The Idea of an HMO-CEO getting 40 Million+ a year and turning down someones operation makes me want to go hunting with my 7MM Mag. Do they think they are Gods?
 
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