Constructing a Homebrew Atomix Air-Atomized Aeroponic System

Trichy Bastard

Trichy Bastard

Well-Known Member
Ester said:
@ Tricky Is that the adapter CP3376-PP in the background in the nozzle images used in the bulkhead attachment? If so do they still run around $51.97 Each? Also what are the numbers on your body and nozzle heads? Wish we had warm weather here to work on projects like you. Happy Holidays.
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I am not giving out the info because there is no proof these nozzles are worth anything at all. Just go out and buy any AA nozzles you like and see if you can get them to work. I fear Dikhead already bought some nozzles from me before testing and we both wasted alot of money on them- let me be the guinnea pig and I'll let you know if they work out ;)...

Siphon feed nozzles are not really ideal in a world where we want to be as precise as possible and have as much control as I strive for- so this is a little bit of a stretch anyway- the only reason I am going forward with these style of nozzles is in the spirit of trying to reproduce the Atomix as closely as possible... Air is the most costly part of running AA- and a good bit of air is used to suck up the nutrients, also the droplet size is likely very fine in the beginning moments of each spray cycle until the siphon flows completely. tree farmer wisely only employs pressure fed nozzles, and a recent note from someone reminded me I could add on a solenoid and convert them to gravity feed if need be- however I want to attempt the siphon feed because it's one advantage -is simplicity- as long as I can maintain the same water level for the siphon's draw reservoir, which I had already created my "siphon box" with a float level valve for the aerolife which I will be using here. The Atomix did not have a constant height for siphon when set for DTW, however G-love seemed to get along just fine if we will believe his pictures...
 
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aerojunkie

Well-Known Member
I thought you already have a water pump/accumulator set up? Why dont you add a solenoid and test flow with the pump?
 
Trichy Bastard

Trichy Bastard

Well-Known Member
aerojunkie said:
I thought you already have a water pump/accumulator set up? Why dont you add a solenoid and test flow with the pump?
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I have considered this, and may, although as mentioned I want to try siphon fed for the reasons just mentioned in my previous post. I definitely can convert to pressure fed easily as I already have the whole setup, however, these nozzles are specifically designed for siphon feed and I am not sure how they will perform under pressure- no pun intended-lol... My thinking is gravity fed is the next easiest method, and probably more likely to work with these siphon nozzles over pressure fed if there is much internal difference over pressure fed nozzles. Merry XMAS Eve to everyone :)
 
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oxanaca

Well-Known Member
hey trichy ive been reading about this for five months or so and have built a aaa 2'x4'x15" system using two delavan #11 nozzles gravity fed. its sitting on a greenhouse bench.
im currently germinating huskey red tomatoe seeds in a flask on a stir plate. after they germinate i will transfer them to test tubes with water, where i will wait for them to stretch
an inch or so.
then there going in 2inch neoprene collars /netpots. i wiill over spray at first so they dont die, then see if i can get some root hairs with shorter misting times.

ill post pics once it gets going
 
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oxanaca

Well-Known Member
got a question for you dude. have you ever though about using a dissection microscope with a stage micrometer(its a fancy microscope slide.
it would give you a good estimate of what kind of micronage your getting from your nozzles, it could probably be turned into a science. my disection microscope cost $65 and you can get a stage micrometer for as little as $21

anyways good luck, i hope one of us figures this out soon. im getting sick of carrying coir up the stairs.
 
Ester

Ester

Active Member
@ Trichy Bastard
I responded to your pm after logging in after a long time. Good luck.
 
Trichy Bastard

Trichy Bastard

Well-Known Member
oxanaca said:
hey trichy ive been reading about this for five months or so and have built a aaa 2'x4'x15" system using two delavan #11 nozzles gravity fed. its sitting on a greenhouse bench.
im currently germinating huskey red tomatoe seeds in a flask on a stir plate. after they germinate i will transfer them to test tubes with water, where i will wait for them to stretch
an inch or so.
then there going in 2inch neoprene collars /netpots. i wiill over spray at first so they dont die, then see if i can get some root hairs with shorter misting times.

ill post pics once it gets going
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Sounds good, keep us posted!
 
Trichy Bastard

Trichy Bastard

Well-Known Member
oxanaca said:
got a question for you dude. have you ever though about using a dissection microscope with a stage micrometer(its a fancy microscope slide.
it would give you a good estimate of what kind of micronage your getting from your nozzles, it could probably be turned into a science. my disection microscope cost $65 and you can get a stage micrometer for as little as $21

anyways good luck, i hope one of us figures this out soon. im getting sick of carrying coir up the stairs.
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Luckilly, I have access to a real particle analyser. I doubt that method would work due to the quick evaporation of the droplets- they have alot of surface area (relative to their mass). Best bet is to use the datasheet specs from a reputable nozzle company who list the sauter mean diameter of the mist.
 
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jamesvagabond

Well-Known Member
Greetings pathlayers! I have been silently absorbing for a while and am gearing to have my own AA setup ASAP. I have to find the right timers, solenoids, pressure switches and nozzles still and am super eager to watch as your project progresses. Thanks for all the dedicated and extensive toiling! Its good to know mad scientists have their foot in the garden.

My intended setup are individual plant chambers with 2-4 atomizer nozzles -siphon fed is ideal if anyone has experienced satisfactory to stellar results. Each chamber is going to be 3'x3'x4', as the method I am using for plant training ends up with 4'x4' single plants. I am not sure if that chamber size is overkill but I don't want any root space limitations. I am interested to hear from the jedi council on this...

Main question: What siphon-fed atomizers have the best reviews/results?

I plan to incorporate a 50+ gallon water tank for air storage (fitted with release valves) to use with the system, is this compatible with siphon feed?

Another huge area of concern for me is Does atomization damage inoculants, organic vitamin/nutrients, myco's? I am familiar with sonication used for the cavitation of cell membranes, and wonder if the sheer force of atomization is enough to rupture delicate compound and/or cell structures. I am mostly concerned with feeding compost tea, anaerobic digester slurry (potent mix of digested biomass from previous harvests, along with algae biomass I grow for my research, and other organic matter, rich in plant hormones, vitamins, minerals, and other nutrients made bioavailable via anaerobic cultures in a reaction chamber), along with root inoculants and beneficial microorganisms. Can anyone help resolve that aneurism? Don't mean to hi-jack if thats what it seems, just taking the questions straight to the source...
 
Trichy Bastard

Trichy Bastard

Well-Known Member
jamesvagabond said:
Greetings pathlayers! I have been silently absorbing for a while and am gearing to have my own AA setup ASAP. I have to find the right timers, solenoids, pressure switches and nozzles still and am super eager to watch as your project progresses. Thanks for all the dedicated and extensive toiling! Its good to know mad scientists have their foot in the garden.

My intended setup are individual plant chambers with 2-4 atomizer nozzles -siphon fed is ideal if anyone has experienced satisfactory to stellar results. Each chamber is going to be 3'x3'x4', as the method I am using for plant training ends up with 4'x4' single plants. I am not sure if that chamber size is overkill but I don't want any root space limitations. I am interested to hear from the jedi council on this...

Main question: What siphon-fed atomizers have the best reviews/results?

I plan to incorporate a 50+ gallon water tank for air storage (fitted with release valves) to use with the system, is this compatible with siphon feed?

Another huge area of concern for me is Does atomization damage inoculants, organic vitamin/nutrients, myco's? I am familiar with sonication used for the cavitation of cell membranes, and wonder if the sheer force of atomization is enough to rupture delicate compound and/or cell structures. I am mostly concerned with feeding compost tea, anaerobic digester slurry (potent mix of digested biomass from previous harvests, along with algae biomass I grow for my research, and other organic matter, rich in plant hormones, vitamins, minerals, and other nutrients made bioavailable via anaerobic cultures in a reaction chamber), along with root inoculants and beneficial microorganisms. Can anyone help resolve that aneurism? Don't mean to hi-jack if thats what it seems, just taking the questions straight to the source...
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The jury is still out on whether siphon fed works well enough, let alone a particular model... Testing testing, trail blazing... I am not sure about the atomisation process damaging living cells, but I would not be interested in doing anything besides a sterile environment with AA, just for nozzle clog issues if nuttin else... Your pod size is large, but big is not a problem like too small is. You still only need one AA atomizer for a chamber that size, and even much larger- they expel quite a plume... Welcome, and keep us posted! :)

ps- are you sure a water tank is designed to hold the pressures? I'd be a but leery, it may be better to use a smaller tank at higher psi, than a large tank at a low psi, but perhaps it will be more energy efficient if you have the space for said water tank...
 
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jamesvagabond

Well-Known Member
Trichy Bastard said:
The jury is still out on whether siphon fed works well enough, let alone a particular model... Testing testing, trail blazing... I am not sure about the atomisation process damaging living cells, but I would not be interested in doing anything besides a sterile environment with AA, just for nozzle clog issues if nuttin else... Your pod size is large, but big is not a problem like too small is. You still only need one AA atomizer for a chamber that size, and even much larger- they expel quite a plume... Welcome, and keep us posted! :)

ps- are you sure a water tank is designed to hold the pressures? I'd be a but leery, it may be better to use a smaller tank at higher psi, than a large tank at a low psi, but perhaps it will be more energy efficient if you have the space for said water tank...
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I don't have one yet, but I read in a different forum, maybe even this thread -I can't keep track anymore ha its all the same heads writing- that a guy was using a 66 gallon water tank that was rated at 125 psi, with regulators and release valves set to 100 psi.

It seems like I may just get air-assisted atomizer nozzles, I'd like the extra control, and with a tank that large I think it is efficient. Fortunately there is an awkward closet space in my room that will fit it. My plan is to use 3 fridge compressors in series to pump the tank, hopefully once a day. If need be, they will be enclosed and insulated for soundproofing.

Any recommendations for air-assisted nozzles?

How is the system coming along? I am excited to hear more developments. You guys have made such an unfathomable contribution, fair to say much more than Richard Stoner (i love it) ever did. What good is
"scientific progress" if the information is not disseminated. How can any advancements be made if it is vanguarded by a small frat of "experts"? I guess gotta keep the serfs from reading. Sorry first stoned rant...can't promise the last.
 
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jamesvagabond

Well-Known Member
And for the inoculants, I guess I can just apply them in the hydroflakes. I imagine they'd travel and spread to the rest of the roots. Hopefully not getting into the sprayers but spores will soar. Dunno if the pressure would prevent buildup but I guess that what testings all about. Molasses for salt build up and h202 for a sterilization run.
 
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oxanaca

Well-Known Member
RainerRocks said:
Does he post on any other forum ?
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i was talking to the fatman for a few weeks on here via personal message.
but now it says i cant send him a message anymore so either he was banned again or
i was asking to many questions that were to far below him and he shut me down
 
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RainerRocks

Active Member
I have read some of his posts here and on other boards and he seems very interesting and know his stuff.

I don't think it was him who is denying you access. When you are banned I don't think you are able to send PM's( Well that's how I had it set-up on my old forum (several years ago non grow related ).

It can be frustrating for very very smart people to relate to other people at times ...I understand these types and don't judge them. I love brillant people because I have such a thirst for knowledge so I can put up with some of their rudeness ...that's just me :)

Maybe the board here reliazed he was PM'ing and shut that down also because he still shows as banned.

Anyway

oxanaca said:
i was talking to the fatman for a few weeks on here via personal message.
but now it says i cant send him a message anymore so either he was banned again or
i was asking to many questions that were to far below him and he shut me down
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jamesvagabond

Well-Known Member
That's the biggest obstacle with science and scientists in general. Being a dreadie in a lab has its adversity, mostly because they want you to be dumb hippie and nothing more. They get super butt-hurt when you actually have tangible ideas from out of the box. There are those who have more of a balance between their right and left brains and can engage more empathetically. Otherwise, it takes a lot of tiptoeing and humoring ego's to find the most efficient way to approach jock scientists.

All they want is recognization and admiration, throw that in every question and Pavlov does the rest... Can't deny their value though, if only they'd open up a little more.

RainerRocks said:
I have read some of his posts here and on other boards and he seems very interesting and know his stuff.

I don't think it was him who is denying you access. When you are banned I don't think you are able to send PM's( Well that's how I had it set-up on my old forum (several years ago non grow related ).

It can be frustrating for very very smart people to relate to other people at times ...I understand these types and don't judge them. I love brillant people because I have such a thirst for knowledge so I can put up with some of their rudeness ...that's just me :)

Maybe the board here reliazed he was PM'ing and shut that down also because he still shows as banned.

Anyway
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GreenThumbSucker

GreenThumbSucker

Well-Known Member
jamesvagabond said:
That's the biggest obstacle with science and scientists in general. Being a dreadie in a lab has its adversity, mostly because they want you to be dumb hippie and nothing more. They get super butt-hurt when you actually have tangible ideas from out of the box. There are those who have more of a balance between their right and left brains and can engage more empathetically. Otherwise, it takes a lot of tiptoeing and humoring ego's to find the most efficient way to approach jock scientists.

All they want is recognization and admiration, throw that in every question and Pavlov does the rest... Can't deny their value though, if only they'd open up a little more.
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Oh, I don't know about all that. I think fatman was just a jerk. Don't need to be a scientist to be guilty of that. He just had no patience for stupid questions.

Having said that, I probably gleaned more usable information from the fatman than every other post I have read combined. He taught me a lot about a lot of different things. He was banned in part because he was a butthead, but more likely because he was giving away formulas for making commercial fertilizer blends from scratch. He was on a mission to show that hydro companies make a fortune ripping off their customers. In that, he succeeded.
 
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localhero

Active Member
No experience with AA or HPA (long time learner/planner/plotter) but to the guy wanting to run organics through his pipes and sprayers, that I do have much experience with. even when filtering my 50 gal tea brewer and sending it out to my field through pvc and pencil lead-sized-opening sprayers, the bio film builds up in the lines and will eventually clog everything. that was outdoors. indoors in my space aged low pressure aero pods I made the mistake of adding some organic additive (i forget the name) that did the exact same thing. I mean bio film clogged everything from the sprayers to the filters nearly killed all my pumps. bottom line, aero in my experience and anything being ran through a sprayer must be sterile and filtered or pure water and cleaned between runs. especially with those tiny opening sprayers used in true high pressure aero or aaa .
 
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