Having a hard time cloning

well i have tried a few clones now and they seem to all do the same thing, go very very droopy and then just go crispy and die :( .

trying to clone a tangerine dream, i cut it at an angle i would say cuttings were roughly 5" tall before they drooped like zombies, i have two that i cloned yeserday still very green but one seems to be very very droopy and the other half as droopy, i dipped them in clonex gel and put into my rooter plugs, they are in a propagator under a 600w hps, i have been spraying them with water, but still very droopy.

am i doing something wrong ? i water them about every 6 hours maybe with a few sprays each, is this too less?

please help i have no more cuttings to take now so its do or die for these last two :(
 

Korner420Garden

Active Member
too much light perhaps? clones dont really need that much light until they have roots. I use two CFLs for my clones and I rarely lose one. I dont even bother cutting them at an angle or dipping them in anything. All they need is water and O2 to take root.

Are you using a dome over them? They need high humidity, but not too high else you run the risk of mold. Do you have them in the same room as the mother? If you have the clones at the level of the mothers canopy, try just placing them under the mother so they get a little less direct light. Also, spraying them every six hours seems excessive. If you use a dome you won't need to spray them at all.
 
i have a 300w cfl i could put them under? and yes i have them on the floor so lower than the rest, is it usual for them to go very droopy, one seems like she can not support herself in any way and the leafs are just hitting the bottom. is it the strain that is hard to clone do you think? barneys farm tangerine dream, its one of the indico dominant phenos i heard was the better phenos to have.
 

J. Smoker

Active Member
This is what i do,. First I soak my rockwool cubes in 5.5 ph water. Then clip a nice clone at a 45^ and dip it in my cloning solution. At this point I place them directly into the cubes. Now I take my sterile scissors and cut the leaves in half and give them a little spray of water. I place them under a humidity dome with the vents closed for two days. After the two days I open the vents and remove the lid daily for a light mist. After a few days remove the dome completely and with a little more care those babies will be rockin! Hope this helps. Its all I do and it never lets me down. Also korner is right, they dont need a lot of light. All i use is a 100w floro.

J.
 

cary schellie

Active Member
mild light, should use a dome for atleast a week, cut under water on an angle with a razor, 1/4 strength nutes, I think clone gel is junk, I like the cheap powder from walmart, take cutting from the lowest part of plant, u can also scrape a fine layer off the tip of the cutting. But I think ur prob really is WAY TO MUCH LIGHT.:peace:
 
ok gus i think it may be the light then, trouble is not really any space for me to set up another place to veg em under my cfl, i dont use rockwool i got some plugs that are kinda like soil but i think there some kind of smart substitute, the domes vents are slightly open and the clear lid become all misty after i mist em and goes clearer after a while when the water evaporates.

i hope they survive would be a shame to lose em il try get em set up under the cfl and try get some pics for you guys to see. il +rep you all now :D
 

DrtyBngWtr

Active Member
ok gus i think it may be the light then, trouble is not really any space for me to set up another place to veg em under my cfl, i dont use rockwool i got some plugs that are kinda like soil but i think there some kind of smart substitute, the domes vents are slightly open and the clear lid become all misty after i mist em and goes clearer after a while when the water evaporates.

i hope they survive would be a shame to lose em il try get em set up under the cfl and try get some pics for you guys to see. il +rep you all now :D
Those plugs are good and you dont need rockwool.. your only problem it your big ass 600 watter lol.... 300 cfl would be fine but be sure to give it 18 inches or so to the top of your clones... you shouldnt need to water those plugs but once every other day... to you scraping and 45 degree angle could you actually tell me how its supposed to help? i know they say it makes it thinner and easier to root.... but why is it i use KID SAFE fiskar scissors(dull flat), while cutting it off STRAIGHT, then putting it in gel and I have roots in 5 days? btw i dont use a damn dome either... some of you people just try and make it to hard on others.... GO BACK TO THE BASICS.... CUT DIP AND WATER!!!!
 

ru4r34l

Well-Known Member
Those plugs are good and you dont need rockwool.. your only problem it your big ass 600 watter lol.... 300 cfl would be fine but be sure to give it 18 inches or so to the top of your clones... you shouldnt need to water those plugs but once every other day... to you scraping and 45 degree angle could you actually tell me how its supposed to help? i know they say it makes it thinner and easier to root.... but why is it i use KID SAFE fiskar scissors(dull flat), while cutting it off STRAIGHT, then putting it in gel and I have roots in 5 days? btw i dont use a damn dome either... some of you people just try and make it to hard on others.... GO BACK TO THE BASICS.... CUT DIP AND WATER!!!!
I agree with this post to a point, keep it simple and if you do not have another light to put them under use a window sill for a week or so then they can go just outside the reach of your 600W for another week, then they will be ready for your 600W laser beam.

regards,
 

panhead

Well-Known Member
Ok,first off you made 3 mistakes that could be the culprit,the reason clones are cut at a 45 degree angle by some is about surface area,an angled cut has more surface area over a straight cut,the cut is full of disrupted cell structures where new roots form,some growers split the stalk down the middle to get more surface area with disrupted cells,same thing with scraping the branch,when you scrape if you scrape down to the white inner layer thats where the cells that make roots lie,scraping or cutting disrupts & exposes them.

Air embolisms,all branches are hollow like a drinking straw,when you cut the clone from the mother air can enter the stalk via the fresh cut,the air bubble stays trapped at the end of the stalk keeping water from being taken up by the cutting,the cutting starts wilting & dies,this is an embolism.

Clonex,what a fukin rip off,clonex works great but why pay $40 a bottle when you can get the exact same shit in powder form at home depot for $5,any cloning product that has INDOLE-3 BUTRIAC ACID will work as good as clonex,super expensive clonex is nothing more than indole 3,the other ingredients are inert & inactive.

Your light is also fucking you up,even a 300 watt cfl is way too much,light should be very minimul,try using a single 24 watt cfl hanging directly over the dome.

More important than light is warmth,the cuttings will root faster & easier if their kept warm,use a heat mat if the temp inside your clone box is under 78 degrees.

Now to fix your cloning technique.

Get a bowl of room temp water & sissors,cut the cutting from the mother making sure everything else is ready,after you take the cutting submerge the entire cutting in the bowl of water,now recut the stalk approx 1 inch higher,all the while being carefull to keep the stalk submerged while the cut is taking place,now if the cutting decides to suck in air from the cut it takes in water instead.

Many growers do not use this method but they should,even the best cloning technique isnt 100% successfull,when experienced cloners have cuttings die its allways from embolisms within the branch.

After you recut the stalk get it dipped in root agent & inside its cube asap,make sure the medium is moist but not soaking wet,i use ROOT RIOT sponge plugs so i can squeeze any extra water out without fucking up the medium from compression.

Keep the clones in a humidome,remove the lid only when you see the condensation on the lid is not covering a large area,when that happens mist the leaves as well as the underside of the humidome,you shouldnt have to remist but once every 2 to 3 days.

In 7 to 10 days you'll have roots.

One more thing,most new cloners are ascared to take large fat cuttings,they fear faliure as well as loosing a good piece of the plant,then they end up cutting wispy lil ass cuttings that are frail as fuk to start with,learn how to top the plant properly & use fat ass cuttings.
 

DrtyBngWtr

Active Member
air hugh... my clones sit in just there net cups after they have been dipped in my gel until all my cutting have been taken... my first cutting sit exposed to the air for a good 30 minutes or so before i finally cut the last one... My place must be airless... bowl of water... your seriously trying to make this harder than it is...
 

J. Smoker

Active Member
I agree with just about everything that all have said in this thread. Almost everyone has a different way (and swear by it ) to take clones. Find the one that works out best for you and go from there.

J.
 

panhead

Well-Known Member
air hugh... my clones sit in just there net cups after they have been dipped in my gel until all my cutting have been taken... my first cutting sit exposed to the air for a good 30 minutes or so before i finally cut the last one... My place must be airless... bowl of water... your seriously trying to make this harder than it is...
Some of you new growers kill me with the typical know it all nonsense,nothing more to contribute other than to dissagree with correct information that they ( you ) personally are not educated in,as for making things harder, how much harder than complete failure can you get,the guy has 100% failure rate using the standard cloning style repeated over & over,should he continue with a method proven to fail him or use a new method ?

Just because you are not aware does not make the information invalid,removing air embolisms is something every florist & amature flower gardener knows & uses,bring home flowers from the florist & put em straight in water & their dead in 5 days,recut the stem under water to remove the embolism & they last 2 weeks,now you've learned something new & this should be a good thing.

Oh,and next time before you just talk shit for the sake of having a reason to post use that time to research embolisms , you'll learn why the underwater method is taught in many botany & gardening classes,beacuse its got a 100% succes rate with growers who have problems cloning using standard methods.
 

TheOrganic

Well-Known Member
https://www.rollitup.org/do-yourself/103903-best-diy-ez-walmart-dwc.html
This worked good for me I just dipped them in powder and let them sit and added water once in a while. I never check PH I just would put a drop of superthrive in there every other day. My well water is excellent.. It did take 2 weeks to get good roots but heard some strains are picky. And the tops where the clones.
They are now in LW soil and just filled up party cup with roots. All under a 4bulb T5
 

Attachments

Marlboro47

Well-Known Member
+rep to panhead, Im glad I diddnt buy some clonex, and for that underwater cutting tip.
So PH water 5.5 is best? Says on the cubes too but just wanted to make sure.
 

agesbuds

Member
Members like Panhead are the type of folks I want to brain pick. He has a wealth of knowledge and im gonna try to study all he has posted. Thanks and I hope you dont mind me asking you questions in PM about my grows??
 

panhead

Well-Known Member
+rep to panhead, Im glad I diddnt buy some clonex, and for that underwater cutting tip.
So PH water 5.5 is best? Says on the cubes too but just wanted to make sure.
Hey man,your welcome & im glad to have been of help.
If your using rockwool 5.5 to 6.0 is good.

I dont use rockwool anymore,i gave up rockwool & replaced it with ROOT RIOT sponge plugs,they are much better than rockwool & suffer none of the issues such as pre ph-ing the cube,water retention,excess compression,its nearly impossible to overwater them & they are neutral ph,plus i grow using sponge as my medium instead of hydroton so its a nice material match.

Clonex really is a bullshit rip off,any product with indole 3 butyric acid works kick ass,the indole 3 has some other uses as well ,somehow it interacts with auxins within the plant & can act as a steroid type additive under controled conditions.

There's a thread somewhere on riu where myself,fdd2blk & a bunch of others used indole 3 butyric acid at various stages of growth & we came up with some pretty cool shit,the bud in my avatar was fed indole 3 & that thing got massive & ugly looking,the members nicknamed the bud "the moose",the pic dont do any justice to the bud,it was larger than a 2 litre pop bottle & looked like a 2 ft long war club, or a cave man club as fdd called it,just be sure your cloning agent has indole 3 in it & ya never have to buy clonex again,you can even turn the powder into a gel by mixing it with organic ky jelly.
 

panhead

Well-Known Member
Members like Panhead are the type of folks I want to brain pick. He has a wealth of knowledge and im gonna try to study all he has posted. Thanks and I hope you dont mind me asking you questions in PM about my grows??
I dont mind at all but if you cant reach me via pm gimme a day or so,the stupid little pm box they give us fills up fast & i get behind once n a while but i will help all i can.
 

phizzion

Well-Known Member
This happened to me on my first time cloning. The stem was not strong enough to hold the top up, and was also too long. I saved the drooping clones by taking plastic straws, cutting them to the length of the clone stems, then slicing the short straw pieces lengthwise and placing around the stems of the clones, making a collar. I misted clones many times a day. After a number of days (4-5), the clones started to stand up. Collars were removed when the clones stood on their own.
 
Top