My plants are dying, please help.

xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
Modern Selections said:
Criticizing MG does not make one a troll. MG is cheap radioactive garbage fertilizer geared towards people who hobby grow flowers and vegetables. You are growing cannabis to be taken into the lungs which makes inputs far more critical. The digestive system can process things, lungs just absorb things.

A bottle of Botanicare is cheap and mostly organic, made with pharmaceutical ingredients. I only mention Botanicare as you can grow tops shelf cannabis using just grow and bloom with proper pH and promix or the like. It does not get easier than that to grow clean safe flowers.
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Even the blue old school blue Miracle Gro has less heavy metals than many of the "Designer" cannabis specific nutrients so it's no more radioactive than what many are spending $20 a bottle to use on their plants.

Their Performance organics line is a decent product. The container soil is similar to FFOF. I used their Performance Organics Bloom fertilizer on outdoor plants this last summer. There is nothing wrong with it.



I'm not trying to shill for MiracleGro. But I don't think MiracleGro is the cause of their issues. There have been MiracleGro threads where growers using MiracleGro were getting better results than some that are using fancy cannabis brands.
 
MissinThe90’sStrains

MissinThe90’sStrains

Well-Known Member
Consider getting stuff like a ph meter and tds or ec meter to test the strength of whatever you’re adding. Itl help you discern whether it’s an issue of over/under feeding. Give yourself some concrete numbers and data to work with, instead of guessing. Also, maybe think about starting with a neutral medium like a pro mix, so that you know everything that’s been put into your plant, and don’t have to speculate later. You’ll know exactly what’s been fed, and at what strength. Itl help you figure out if you have deficiencies or lockouts a lot easier. It also gives you and anyone trying to help, less conflicting variables.
 
Dorian2

Dorian2

Well-Known Member
MisterBlack said:
Referenced twice in an attempt to keep the trolls from criticizing the MG fert.
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I can understand the criticism considering I've used it for outdoor plants for a couple decades. With something as temperamental as a weed plant, I'd probably consider one more suitable for the task. Maybe try another option next round?
 
Modern Selections

Modern Selections

Well-Known Member
xtsho said:
Even the blue old school blue Miracle Gro has less heavy metals than many of the "Designer" cannabis specific nutrients so it's no more radioactive than what many are spending $20 a bottle to use on their plants.

Their Performance organics line is a decent product. The container soil is similar to FFOF. I used their Performance Organics Bloom fertilizer on outdoor plants this last summer. There is nothing wrong with it.



I'm not trying to shill for MiracleGro. But I don't think MiracleGro is the cause of their issues. There have been MiracleGro threads where growers using MiracleGro were getting better results than some that are using fancy cannabis brands.
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We are going to have to agree to disagree on this one friend.
 
MisterBlack

MisterBlack

Active Member
xtsho said:
Even the blue old school blue Miracle Gro has less heavy metals than many of the "Designer" cannabis specific nutrients so it's no more radioactive than what many are spending $20 a bottle to use on their plants.

Their Performance organics line is a decent product. The container soil is similar to FFOF. I used their Performance Organics Bloom fertilizer on outdoor plants this last summer. There is nothing wrong with it.



I'm not trying to shill for MiracleGro. But I don't think MiracleGro is the cause of their issues. There have been MiracleGro threads where growers using MiracleGro were getting better results than some that are using fancy cannabis brands.
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Thank you for adding this. I just didn't want to argue with anyone about it when I know from experience that it is not the issue. I have used it a lot with good results so there is no reason for it to be a problem now unless I accidentally overdosed them, which I am sure I did not, or there is build up in the soil, which it could be, but not a problem specific to MG. But still, I flushed them and they were worse a week later. Trying new medium now to see if one improves.
 
MisterBlack

MisterBlack

Active Member
curious2garden said:
That's what immediately came to mind. Although you can't really over water coco so let's look on the bright side.
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Yes, I repotted with coco / perlite that my friend uses. I don't know the ratio, it's just a test using what came out of his bucket. His plant's do well enough in it for a test. My plants don't get over waterered, but possible not enough for the small amount of run off to carry away any build up. Could be why previous grows did better, I drenched them more than I do now. That just occured to me.
 
curious2garden

curious2garden

Well-Known Mod
Staff member
MisterBlack said:
Yes, I repotted with coco / perlite that my friend uses. I don't know the ratio, it's just a test using what came out of his bucket. His plant's do well enough in it for a test. My plants don't get over waterered, but possible not enough for the small amount of run off to carry away any build up. Could be why previous grows did better, I drenched them more than I do now. That just occured to me.
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The ratio of perlite to coco doesn't really matter. I grow in 50/50 coco/perlite after starting off in rails. Make no mistake you are now in hydro. You need to keep your coco moist and feed with each watering. Since you're just starting with coco be prepared to flush them every 2 weeks to get rid of any built up salts as almost everyone (including me) overfeeds at the start. Some of us still do. By flush I mean a 1 time watering with a low osmolar solution.

You need an EC/TDS pen and a pH pen at the very least. You also need to know something about your water's profile.

What lights are you running indoors as you need a decent light to drive growth.

PS I have friends that use MG products to grow with. Then again with a PhD in Biochem some people can make anything work.
 
MisterBlack

MisterBlack

Active Member
StareCase said:
@MisterBlack - when you grew in soil ... what was the pH of the source water/feed? I have been through this thread a few times and didn't find it.
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I haven't checked the water pH in a long time so I will try to do it later. I checked pH of the water and feed mix when I started growing about a year ago, but it was always within spec, right around 6. After a few checks, it didn't bother anymore because I had the same routine every time. My friend pointed out that when I added the magnesium, I lower the pH, which I knew it would but failed to consider. However, I added that in an attempt to help the sick plants, it was not the cause. It could have made them worse though. Thank you for the suggestion, I will look into that tonight.
 
StareCase

StareCase

Well-Known Member
MisterBlack said:
... when I started growing about a year ago, but it was always within spec, right around 6 ...
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Nutes might have been out of range ... cause for soil, that's a low pH.

For those times when I ran out of my usual peat based stuff and used a garden soil, the pH of source water/feed was set to 6.6. Next time you try a soil grow, raise your pH to between 6.5 - 6.7 and see if those deficiencies are eradicated.
 
MisterBlack

MisterBlack

Active Member
curious2garden said:
The ratio of perlite to coco doesn't really matter. I grow in 50/50 coco/perlite after starting off in rails. Make no mistake you are now in hydro. You need to keep your coco moist and feed with each watering. Since you're just starting with coco be prepared to flush them every 2 weeks to get rid of any built up salts as almost everyone (including me) overfeeds at the start. Some of us still do. By flush I mean a 1 time watering with a low osmolar solution.

You need an EC/TDS pen and a pH pen at the very least. You also need to know something about your water's profile.

What lights are you running indoors as you need a decent light to drive growth.

PS I have friends that use MG products to grow with. Then again with a PhD in Biochem some people can make anything work.
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That's good advice, thank you. Since my buddy grows in it, I know it needs feeding, but I didn't know to flush it every two weeks. I borrowed his pens but I don't know how reliable they will be. I had some that I tried before but the readings were wild and all over the place, even after calibration.

I started this grow with the two LED lights, and about a month ago I added the Sun System light hoping it would help the sickly plants. It did not, but I don't think it hurt any. Adding the 3rd light was an attempt to help, it was not the cause.
 

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MisterBlack

MisterBlack

Active Member
StareCase said:
Nutes might have been out of range ... cause for soil, that's a low pH.

For those times when I ran out of my usual peat based stuff and used a garden soil, the pH of source water/feed was set to 6.6. Next time you try a soil grow, raise your pH to between 6.5 - 6.7 and see if those deficiencies are eradicated.
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Alright, I can do that. Thank you. Going to do some tests later and see what the water is nowadays in case it changed and also with some fert.
 
curious2garden

curious2garden

Well-Known Mod
Staff member
MisterBlack said:
That's good advice, thank you. Since my buddy grows in it, I know it needs feeding, but I didn't know to flush it every two weeks. I borrowed his pens but I don't know how reliable they will be. I had some that I tried before but the readings were wild and all over the place, even after calibration.

I started this grow with the two LED lights, and about a month ago I added the Sun System light hoping it would help the sickly plants. It did not, but I don't think it hurt any. Adding the 3rd light was an attempt to help, it was not the cause.
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Get your own pens and calibration solution. I have a cheap Milwaukee TDS pen that is accurate and stay calibrated and an expensive Bluelab pH pen I love but it needs more frequent calibration but it is accurate.

I don't know what the draw is from the wall on your LEDs but your CMH should get you through for a handful of plants (it will only flower about a 3x3).
 
MisterBlack

MisterBlack

Active Member
Dorian2 said:
I can understand the criticism considering I've used it for outdoor plants for a couple decades. With something as temperamental as a weed plant, I'd probably consider one more suitable for the task. Maybe try another option next round?
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I have some ff stuff but I never use it. I know a lot of people like it though. I don't want to start buying expensive fert because I go through a lot, but I don't know if the MG has some of the micronutrients that the ff has. Still, I did have good luck with the MG for a while. Maybe it got built up in the soil. I go through a fair amount of fertilizer because I have a lot of plants in the summertime, and there is no way I can buy ff or other specialized fert for them all, so I would rather use just one general purpose fert on everything. If that makes sense.
 
curious2garden

curious2garden

Well-Known Mod
Staff member
MisterBlack said:
Yes, that's what was available. It was clean and new. What's wrong with that?
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She's pointing out you are out of the frying pan and into the fire.

MisterBlack said:
I have some ff stuff but I never use it. I know a lot of people like it though. I don't want to start buying expensive fert because I go through a lot, but I don't know if the MG has some of the micronutrients that the ff has. Still, I did have good luck with the MG for a while. Maybe it got built up in the soil. I go through a fair amount of fertilizer because I have a lot of plants in the summertime, and there is no way I can buy ff or other specialized fert for them all, so I would rather use just one general purpose fert on everything. If that makes sense.
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You can't use MG in hydro. I mean I suppose you could but that would be above my paygrade. I don't know about FF nutrients in hydro either. I've only used GH Flora Trio and DynaGro Foliage Pro but you're in hydro now so you need to make some adjustments.
 
MisterBlack

MisterBlack

Active Member
curious2garden said:
Get your own pens and calibration solution. I have a cheap Milwaukee TDS pen that is accurate and stay calibrated and an expensive Bluelab pH pen I love but it needs more frequent calibration but it is accurate.

I don't know what the draw is from the wall on your LEDs but your CMH should get you through for a handful of plants (it will only flower about a 3x3).
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Yeah, it's hard to say about the LEDs without testing the draw. I got a meter for it but it's somewhere else at the moment. I was shooting for around 600W total in a 4x4, but with LEDs, I don't really know what I'm getting. Tried a PAR meter, but it was academic since that grow was fine. And I did get my own pens but they were terrible and I returned them. Since everything was going ok, I didn't bother replacing.
 
MisterBlack

MisterBlack

Active Member
curious2garden said:
She's pointing out you are out of the frying pan and into the fire.


You can't use MG in hydro. I mean I suppose you could but that would be above my paygrade. I don't know about FF nutrients in hydro either. I've only used GH Flora Trio and DynaGro Foliage Pro but you're in hydro now so you need to make some adjustments.
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I know what she was pointing out, I want to know why testing with new, clean medium to see it there is an improvement is a mistake. I have only grown in soil, no hydro at all ever unless you count the last 15 hours when I put one in coco for a test.
 
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