No fillibuster for Repukes.Talks move forward

jeffchr · Nov 22, 2009

there are almost 50 million people in this country without coverage
the insurance companies are spending $1 million / day lobbying against any type of healthcare reform
health insurance company's profits have soared over 400% in the last 8-years
health insurance premiums have increased 150% since 2000
the U.S. is 42nd on the list of healthiest countries, in terms of life expectancy
more money is spent on healthcare, per person, in the U.S. compared to ANY OTHER COUNTRY IN THE WORLD
the cost of medical care in the U.S. exceeds all other countries in the United Nations, except for East Timor
Medical debt is the principal cause of bankruptcy in the United States
almost all industrialized countries have a national healthcare program
every year, more than 10x the number of people killed on 9/11 die from lack of insurance
this is a national disaster - what the fuck is government for, if not to fix this
the enemy is the insurance companies, not the government, not the democrats, not the republicans or independents
i'm for any plan that removes the insurance companies from the equation

Illegal Smile · Nov 22, 2009

londonfog said:
We will see...are you the same one that said Obama would not be elected....how that work out for ya

I wasn't even on riu before the elction so it wasn't me. Maybe someone can explain where 60 votes are going to come from to pass a public option. You have 40 republicans plus 2 democrats plus Lieberman saying no way. Even if the 2 democrats fold, Lieberman will never. The public option has been dead a long time, the dems just can't bring themselves to tell their wacko left wing.

Illegal Smile · Nov 22, 2009

jeffchr said:
there are almost 50 million people in this country without coverage
the insurance companies are spending $1 million / day lobbying against any type of healthcare reform
health insurance company's profits have soared over 400% in the last 8-years
health insurance premiums have increased 150% since 2000
the U.S. is 42nd on the list of healthiest countries, in terms of life expectancy
more money is spent on healthcare, per person, in the U.S. compared to ANY OTHER COUNTRY IN THE WORLD
the cost of medical care in the U.S. exceeds all other countries in the United Nations, except for East Timor
Medical debt is the principal cause of bankruptcy in the United States
almost all industrialized countries have a national healthcare program
every year, more than 10x the number of people killed on 9/11 die from lack of insurance
this is a national disaster - what the fuck is government for, if not to fix this
the enemy is the insurance companies, not the government, not the democrats, not the republicans or independents
i'm for any plan that removes the insurance companies from the equation

This was funny up to the part about people dying from lack of insurance, then it became hilarious.

Keenly · Nov 22, 2009

there is no being on this earth that can tell me what i HAVE TO buy

never...

i will most likely be arrested or fined for not having medical insurance and you know what?

fine, if thats how you pro healthcare peeps really want it

Fascism Ahoy!

Illegal Smile · Nov 22, 2009

There is no question but that it is unconstitutional for the government to legally require citizens to buy a product of any kind, especially not one that they, the government, are selling in competition with the private sector.

Jack*Herrer420 · Nov 22, 2009

londonfog said:
Health Care For All will be a great thing and remember it still has work to be done on it..... The joy is from its being discussed .... All you people who are against it probable need not concern themselves about cost...Now if you make enough where as it would cost you then hell be happy that you are helping others..... We suppose to live in the best country in the world and we can't get all its people health care..please......I still have not heard one person tell me how to fix the problems with health care only that "we don't want government control." Give me a break the government stepping up and doing something positive for the people and you bytch about it....We all know the truth... its just Obama doing it and you guys can't handle it... so if you are rich get your pocket books out and if not hell it will be subsidized...READ THE BILL

You may be the one who needs to READ THE PREVIOUS POSTS. Myself and others have stated things that can be changed, yet you read past it and act as if we are just complaining. You are saying that if you are rich, expect to pay higher taxes, and if you are poor, you don't have to pay anything. What is wrong with you? Do you believe that you have the right to tell others how to spend their money? Just because somebody worked hard throughout their life, and have money to show for it, you want them to take care of those who haven't amounted to anything. You obviously don't have any concept of self reliance, workmanship, or pride. You believe it is somebody elses job to take care of you and others whom are to lazy to provide for themselves and their families.
We do live in the greatest country in the world, and it is due to the fact that americans have principles and honor. Way back when, when somebody couldn't afford something, they would get a second job, and budget their incomes. Don't buy something if you can't afford it, that used to be common knowledge, but now it's more like buy whatever you want, if you can't afford it print more money or borrow from China.
And since you keep addressing that we haven't answered your questions, why don't you answer some of mine. That might require you to actually read the previous posts, I won't hold my breath.

londonfog · Nov 22, 2009

Jack*Herrer420 said:
You may be the one who needs to READ THE PREVIOUS POSTS. Myself and others have stated things that can be changed, yet you read past it and act as if we are just complaining. You are saying that if you are rich, expect to pay higher taxes, and if you are poor, you don't have to pay anything. What is wrong with you? Do you believe that you have the right to tell others how to spend their money? Just because somebody worked hard throughout their life, and have money to show for it, you want them to take care of those who haven't amounted to anything. You obviously don't have any concept of self reliance, workmanship, or pride. You believe it is somebody elses job to take care of you and others whom are to lazy to provide for themselves and their families.
We do live in the greatest country in the world, and it is due to the fact that americans have principles and honor. Way back when, when somebody couldn't afford something, they would get a second job, and budget their incomes. Don't buy something if you can't afford it, that used to be common knowledge, but now it's more like buy whatever you want, if you can't afford it print more money or borrow from China.
And since you keep addressing that we haven't answered your questions, why don't you answer some of mine. That might require you to actually read the previous posts, I won't hold my breath.

Dude the only one that had any suggestions was ilkhan..You offer nothing but complaints...so please...and America used to be the greastest country in the world now that is questioned..I suggest you travel outside the states ...it might open your eyes...You say keep government out of the equation..I say bring on the competition..Insurance company steady raping us and you say its all good..we happy with what we got....My wife pays out the azz for our coverage..I could just use the VA , but I don't because I won't to reserve that space for some VA who really can't afford insurance...I being a small business owner will now have to find a way to get my employees coverage...See me complaining..Hell no..because I see what is going to be offered to us...So please with the talk "MR. HELL NO THEY TOOK MY JOBS"..Take the time and read the bill...and more work is going to be done on it....I'm so happy we are having a discussion on Health Care For all..America finally trying to do something for her people...

Keenly · Nov 22, 2009

why do you ignore the mandatory insurance requirement?

its just fucking ridiculous how they think they can tell me what i have to buy, whether i use it or not

Jack*Herrer420 · Nov 22, 2009

londonfog said:
Dude the only one that had any suggestions was ilkhan..You offer nothing but complaints...so please...and America used to be the greastest country in the world now that is questioned..I suggest you travel outside the states ...it might open your eyes...You say keep government out of the equation..I say bring on the compatition..Insurance company steady raping us and you say its all good..we happy with what we got....My wife pays out the azz for our coverage..I could just use the VA , but I don't because I won't to reserve that space for some VA who really can't afford insurance...I being a small business owner will now have to find a way to get my employees coverage...See me complaining..Hell no..because I see what is going to be offered to us...So please with the talk "MR. HELL NO THEY TOOK MY JOBS"..Take the time and read the bill...and more work is going to be done on it....I'm so happy we are having a discussion on Health Care For all..America finally trying to do something for her people...

Does tort reform, tax credits, individual savings accounts ring a bell, did I not answer your question? It seems you are the one who is dodging the questions. You conveniently don't respond to posts you don't have answers for, so please answer some of my questions. You say you aren't complaining, but that's all you have done. You have repeatedly said that the rich need to take care of the poor, and that the government is the answer. When you say bring on the competition, are you talking about government, because if you are you must have brain damage. You think that replacing private insurance with government is going to increase coverage and quality, you are mistaken. You must be the bill master, seeing as you have stated "read the bill", in every post. did you read the bill? America isn't about a government nanny state, which you so desire, rather a place where individuals care for themselves and their families. From your posts, I would assume that you have no sense of self reliance, honor or pride as already stated.

jeffchr · Nov 22, 2009

Illegal Smile said:
There is no question but that it is unconstitutional for the government to legally require citizens to buy a product of any kind, especially not one that they, the government, are selling in competition with the private sector.

i have yet to hear a congressperson criticize the healthcare bill on the grounds that it is unconstitutional. that is not one of the counter-points to the debate, mostly because it is a futile and ignorant argument.

londonfog · Nov 22, 2009

Jack*Herrer420 said:
Does tort reform, tax credits, individual savings accounts ring a bell, did I not answer your question? It seems you are the one who is dodging the questions. You conveniently don't respond to posts you don't have answers for, so please answer some of my questions. You say you aren't complaining, but that's all you have done. You have repeatedly said that the rich need to take care of the poor, and that the government is the answer. When you say bring on the competition, are you talking about government, because if you are you must have brain damage. You think that replacing private insurance with government is going to increase coverage and quality, you are mistaken. You must be the bill master, seeing as you have stated "read the bill", in every post. did you read the bill? America isn't about a government nanny state, which you so desire, rather a place where individuals care for themselves and their families. From your posts, I would assume that you have no sense of self reliance, honor or pride as already stated.

First I will cover what is highlighted in red ( the other stuff is Repuke Prop talk )

Government is not replacing private insurance only adding more competition..if you like what you got keep it..simple..again read the bill..the Health reform is needed and the only why to get it down is with the help of our government..even if you used tax credits or tort reform you will still have the government involved and I for one see the insurance companies trying to screw us now what makes you think that they will just stop..... please government get involved on this one...hey did you know the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office has projected that Reid's 2,074-page bill would extend health insurance coverage to 31 million additional Americans. The agency estimates that the proposal would reduce the federal deficit by $130 billion over the next 10 years, through 2019. Any effect on the deficit in the following decade would be "subject to substantial uncertainty," but probably would result in "small reductions in federal budget deficits," according to budget office analysts.and thats coming from the CBO..you know better then they ???? again read the damn bill... and last but not least son I spent 22 years serving my nation in the USAF, so far as pride, honor and self reliance..I think I could teach you a think or two...I'm retired from the service own my own businesses and still give back to my community..Today alone my wife and I spent our morning passing out 150 turkeys to needed families at our place of business all coming out of our pockets..What have you done today besides complain...STFU and learn to help others...Health Care For All

CrackerJax · Nov 22, 2009

Nonsense..... pure nonsense.

londonfog · Nov 22, 2009

CrackerJax said:
Nonsense..... pure nonsense.

coming from the guy who thinks greed cannot increase

Jack*Herrer420 · Nov 22, 2009

londonfog said:
First I will cover what is highlighted in red ( the other stuff is Repuke Prop talk )

Government is not replacing private insurance only adding more competition..if you like what you got keep it..simple..again read the bill..the Health reform is needed and the only why to get it down is with the help of our government..even if you used tax credits or tort reform you will still have the government involved and I for one see the insurance companies trying to screw us now what makes you think that they will just stop please government get involved on this one...hey did you know the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office has projected that Reid's 2,074-page bill would extend health insurance coverage to 31 million additional Americans. The agency estimates that the proposal would reduce the federal deficit by $130 billion over the next 10 years, through 2019. Any effect on the deficit in the following decade would be "subject to substantial uncertainty," but probably would result in "small reductions in federal budget deficits," according to budget office analysts.and thats coming from the CBO..you know better then they ???? again read the damn bill... and last but not least son I spent 22 years serving my nation in the USAF, so far as pride, honor and self reliance..I think I could teach you a think or two...I'm retired from the service own my own businesses and still give back to my community..Today alone my wife and I spent our morning passing out 150 turkeys to needed families at our place of business all coming out of our pockets..What have you done today besides complain...STFU and learn to help others...Health Care For All

I believe you have started off with that same sentence about three times now, I would think it was you spewing out liberal talking points. Government is getting their foot in the door, it is Obama's and the democrats plan to have a single payer system, so you can continue to say that they are creating competition, when that is nothing but an ignorant, uneducated statement. Have you read the whole bill, just answer that simple question. The difference is how yourself and I want government involved. I would prefer them give tax credits and lower taxes for everybody, while you would prefer the government to force the rich to pay for everything. I don't really care what the cbo says, a government agency, that has always underscored the costs of anything they touch. Reid's bill will do nothing to lower costs for individuals, and will impose regulations on individuals before they recieve health insurance.
You must be captain America. I would love to see what an air force retiree can teach a devil dog. How much discipline and honor were you taught in the air force? I ACTUALLY served my time in the Marine Corps doing something that really mattered, so I would love to see what you could teach me.You think you are the only vet on this site, doesn't mean nothing. I wanna strive to be just like you, spending my mornings handing out food, because I believe I am better than everybody else.

londonfog · Nov 22, 2009

Oh silly silly man... I don't think I'm better then anyone..I merely needed to show you that you not talking to someone who does not just talk the talk but does it as well...Did you not say I'm someone who takes handout..Just trying to clear up the stupidity on your part..I see that you and I will just have to agree to disagree

Keenly · Nov 22, 2009

Forcing people to purchase something or be fined or jailed = unconstitutional

why can you guys not wrap your mind around this one

they have a gun to your head

they are saying, buy insurance, or get fined and go to jail

jeffchr · Nov 22, 2009

Keenly said:
Forcing people to purchase something or be fined or jailed = unconstitutional

why can you guys not wrap your mind around this one

they have a gun to your head

they are saying, buy insurance, or get fined and go to jail

i don't agree because i haven't heard any constitutional experts espouse that opinion. that is your opinion. you have no credibility on the subject. sorry, but you don't.

londonfog · Nov 22, 2009

Keenly said:
Forcing people to purchase something or be fined or jailed = unconstitutional

why can you guys not wrap your mind around this one

they have a gun to your head

they are saying, buy insurance, or get fined and go to jail

keenly now I really do see your point on this one, but if it takes everyone to participate then so be it...I have to pay insurance for my car and boat ..I don't won't to but I have to .....home owners insurance...that too ...heck insurance for the business case someone gets hurt...really hate that one....I also have to pay taxes...are these unconstitutional as well ?????

londonfog · Nov 22, 2009

Let the talks began....

Jack*Herrer420 · Nov 22, 2009

londonfog said:
Let the talks began....

The problem is that you expect everybody to pay for this mess, even if they want nothing to do with it. Most Americans don't support this, and every single poll proves this. Is it such a hard concept to grasp that americans don't want the government telling them what to do? You could be on any side of the aisle and see how government is contolling the people. But once you get someone in office that you support, you disregard any government influence or control.

No fillibuster for Repukes.Talks move forward

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