Uncle Ben's Topping Technique to Get 2 or 4 Main Colas
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collieBudz
Well-Known Member
i dont see why you got your panties in a bunch, all over this site 'reputable' people ADVOCATE lucas formula... VIRedd potroast and the list goes on and on, here and other forums, so i just took what i thought was good advice, and youre trying to make me out to be a mad scientist ? lol youre a weird dude, im sure you've been told, if not regularly, so i'll leave it at that in terms of you personally.. just so you know, a normal person would have more than likely replied something more like this :
I dont really believe in that formula as its only using 2 of 3 parts of a 3 part etc etc or whatever it is that is so out there to you, cause im not entirely sure..from what i read, the GROW formula of the 3part isnt needed because the micro possesses all the N you need.....
micro 5-0-1
bloom 0-5-4
and apparently in the ration of 5ml and 10ml respectively, they are the 'proper' ratio needed, do i know this to be absolute fact? nope, im not a botanist or anything like that, otherwise i wouldnt be asking you sir, to bestowe on me youre plethora of knowledge..lol
and if it was the cloning, i mean, do me a favor, go search for cloning guide, cloning tips, cloning tricks, any of the above, and tell me if the person isn't suggesting cutting the stem off at 45degree angle, pretty freakin crazy idea huh? i know its outlandish, only a black magic evil dooer would even attempt such trickery, but thats what ive read to do to make it go smoother.. so guess what? i tried it! cause afterall , as stated at least 5-10 times, this is a TRIAL, right? .. and so you know, i also tried the 'old fashioned' way to see if one works better than the other, or hell, if they work at all... but it's cool buddy, i'll ask someone else for help, as youve by far been the least helpful.. have a good one
collieBudz
Well-Known Member
ontop of that i took all that time to explain to you as best possible how and why they woudl be stunted, lol , and you dont have the time, what a clown, why not just say from the beginning to nevermind
Katatawnic
Well-Known Member
I've not heard of Lucas formula. As far as the cloning, yes... every book, guide, tutorial, etc., I've come across says to cut the stem at a 45* angle and most say to snip the end vertically a bit. I do believe it's hogwash, however, only because I've been taking cuttings since I was about 7 or 8. (Not cannabis though! lol) And I never did those things. Just snipped where I wanted, and plopped the new cutting into the new soil. (Humidity domes do help though, so long as they are ventilated.)
I've read that cutting at a 45* angle helps to prevent the mother plant from getting infection at the wound site. But again, I personally find that to be hogwash. If everything is sanitary when doing these things, all should be just fine.
Unfortunately, as soon as one delves into growing cannabis, all these strange methods appear that, if we don't do just so, will doom us to unhappy plants, if not dead. There's way too much mystique placed on cannabis... as if it is nothing less than sheer miraculous magic, in the guise of a plant. It all can make one wonder how in the world it evolved on its own, before we came along and discovered its wonderful properties.
Equally unfortunate is the vast variety of advice we find on forums for growing cannabis, given for any one area. It can all be so confusing as to which to follow, especially if one doesn't understand botany enough to know what simply has the most common sense.
If something is made out to be much more difficult or time consuming, etc., then most likely it's not necessary... if not straight out damaging. Keep on with your trial run, but try to keep this in mind when perusing sites like this one. To date, the only method I've found helpful that involves more time and/or work is LST (Low Stress Training, or tying down branches)... I wouldn't bother with it if I weren't constrained to a certain number of plants in order to keep myself and those who live with me out of jail (MMJ in my state). But aside from LST (of which I do much less now than I did a couple months ago), I just feed and water my plants as they need it. I leave the slave labor to those who have the time and physical capacity.
I've read that cutting at a 45* angle helps to prevent the mother plant from getting infection at the wound site. But again, I personally find that to be hogwash. If everything is sanitary when doing these things, all should be just fine.
Unfortunately, as soon as one delves into growing cannabis, all these strange methods appear that, if we don't do just so, will doom us to unhappy plants, if not dead. There's way too much mystique placed on cannabis... as if it is nothing less than sheer miraculous magic, in the guise of a plant. It all can make one wonder how in the world it evolved on its own, before we came along and discovered its wonderful properties.
Equally unfortunate is the vast variety of advice we find on forums for growing cannabis, given for any one area. It can all be so confusing as to which to follow, especially if one doesn't understand botany enough to know what simply has the most common sense.
If something is made out to be much more difficult or time consuming, etc., then most likely it's not necessary... if not straight out damaging. Keep on with your trial run, but try to keep this in mind when perusing sites like this one. To date, the only method I've found helpful that involves more time and/or work is LST (Low Stress Training, or tying down branches)... I wouldn't bother with it if I weren't constrained to a certain number of plants in order to keep myself and those who live with me out of jail (MMJ in my state). But aside from LST (of which I do much less now than I did a couple months ago), I just feed and water my plants as they need it. I leave the slave labor to those who have the time and physical capacity.
DoeEyed
Well-Known Member
I just have to say, I am eternally grateful you posted this info, Uncle Ben. I tried FIMming before, and out of 23 plants, got maybe one right. I tried your topping method on all of my three week old Trainwreck (and a Moby Dick) - they responded within 24 hours, and six days later, you would think they grew that way natural. A pic of both after 24 hours and same plant six days later. Thanks a bunch!kiss-ass
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Uncle Ben
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collieBudz, the topic of this thread is topping. I don't find it a problem for folks to go off a bit in my thread, hell I'm one of the worst. But I'm not here in this thread to teach plant basics, only offer tips or tweaks. Your plant is stunted which could be due to several factors, the Lucas formula I suspect being the main culprit. Also, I don't care if "everyone is doing it". Doesn't mean "it" is the best way, only proof that cannabis forums are full of lemmings. Sorry you got offended but "bogging" instead of practicing conventional upcanning methods and cutting a cutting at a 45* angle because "they say" it promotes rooting is just plain crap. If you can give me a valid cause/effect relationship based on science, not anecdotal evidence, I'll buy into it. If cannabis forum drills are not practiced by "normal" ag, horticultural professionals, nurserymen and such, I'm going to scoff at those practices. For instance, if sugar (or molasses) was so good for cannabis and other plant material, it would be sold as fertilizer.
As an aside, I doubt if the "Lucas" formula contains all 16 essential elements for excellent plant health.
We'll just call the following advice "tough love"
- get that damn thing out of that stupid bucket, get you some high quality potting soil, carefully upcan it to a quart or one gallon pot (do not break up the rootball)...... bury the "trunk" up to the first leaf sets, give it good light, temps 85/60F day/night, only water when the pot feels light, give it a high N food (30-10-10) available from Walmart and/or add blood meal to the mix and grow some pot!
Man, could I show you some Trainwreck. I find uploading pix a PITA but I'll try it again.
Collie, open the first photo please. Those plants are just one week old from the point in time they broke the soil's surface. At 2 weeks old garden is easily double that. Yes, I do have pix.
Second shot is a nice shot showing the 4 main cola output on a cross me and my buddy "Di" did. I sent him some C99 pollen from an excellent C99 F1 male, he did the dirty deed with some Vietnam Dalat ladies he snuck outta da jungles of Dalat Vietnam.
Ben
As an aside, I doubt if the "Lucas" formula contains all 16 essential elements for excellent plant health.
We'll just call the following advice "tough love"
- get that damn thing out of that stupid bucket, get you some high quality potting soil, carefully upcan it to a quart or one gallon pot (do not break up the rootball)...... bury the "trunk" up to the first leaf sets, give it good light, temps 85/60F day/night, only water when the pot feels light, give it a high N food (30-10-10) available from Walmart and/or add blood meal to the mix and grow some pot!That's why it's been nicknamed "Fuck I Missed".
Nice job! Now wasn't that nice and simple?
Man, could I show you some Trainwreck. I find uploading pix a PITA but I'll try it again.
Collie, open the first photo please. Those plants are just one week old from the point in time they broke the soil's surface. At 2 weeks old garden is easily double that. Yes, I do have pix.
Second shot is a nice shot showing the 4 main cola output on a cross me and my buddy "Di" did. I sent him some C99 pollen from an excellent C99 F1 male, he did the dirty deed with some Vietnam Dalat ladies he snuck outta da jungles of Dalat Vietnam.
Ben
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Uncle Ben
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Cross of TrainwreckXSweettooth 42 days into flowering. Notice the dark green leaves. That's what you should be aiming for ladies and gents - abundant medium to dark green leaves.
That's what produces rock hard, fat colas (see pix #2, 3, 4)
Grow hard,
UB
That's what produces rock hard, fat colas (see pix #2, 3, 4)
Grow hard,
UB
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I hope mine turn out even half that well. No need to ask if they smoked well...
DoeEyed
Well-Known Member
That would be great, I hope you decide to do it! I'm curious, sorry if it's already here somewhere, what nutes do you use for flowering? I seem to do ok with the vegging - but thus far, not so good flowering. But all I have right now for flowering nutes is MG Bloom Booster, and either it's crap, or I'm useing it wrong. What do you recommend?
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
I use whatever foods I think will support leaf health and retention. Could be a 30-10-10, could be a 10-30-20. Depends....
The Bloom foods industry is all about the money - labels, hype, etc. Only you can decide thru experience if a 30-5-20 is enough P to support flowering, the flowering response being photoperiod initiated. It's the leaves that provide food for bud production, not us.
Think outside of the box,
Tio
DoeEyed
Well-Known Member
Wow, now you've got me thinking...
lol seriously, all the reading I've done over the past four months, and boy I mean a LOT, and what you just said never once occurred to me. Thanks.
Dr.RR
Active Member
I've got a question and I apologize in advance if it's been asked, but I did read through the first 15 pages before deciding to ask!
How exactly do you cut the stem? I am planning on cutting above the second node for 4 new colas. Do you just take a razor blade and cut it? Do you cut at an angle? Do you pinch first and then cut?
This has been one of the best threads I've read here to date. Appreciate the time you put into this Uncle Ben.
How exactly do you cut the stem? I am planning on cutting above the second node for 4 new colas. Do you just take a razor blade and cut it? Do you cut at an angle? Do you pinch first and then cut?
This has been one of the best threads I've read here to date. Appreciate the time you put into this Uncle Ben.
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Glad that helped. Folks just seem to follow along rather than asking "why".Wow, now you've got me thinking...
If you have nails, use your thumbnail and index finger and just pinch the sucker off, that's what I do....... or, if you're anal and believe that only a half waning moon with Jupiter lined up with Mars at the 38 parallel will do, then, do it. Gotta be at a 48.75 angle using your Dad's Winchester buckknife of course.
Really, doesn't matter. Just leave enough stem above the node to callous over. 1/2" is fine. I posted photos of freshly pinched/cut plants yesterday and on the first page.
Glad you like the thread.
Tio
Dr.RR
Active Member
Lol, thanks for replying to my question. I like your style man, sarcasm is always good!
So just to clarify, it does not matter if the cut is at a 45* angle correct?
DoeEyed
Well-Known Member
lol He's just kidding - I snipped mine with a small hair cutting scissors, no biggie - I would add to be careful in there though, too easy to snip something you don't want to. I accidently snipped part of a small fan leaf and part of another stem, so yeah - just take your time. They came out fine anyway - but it did slow growth on the two areas I snipped without meaning to.Lol, thanks for replying to my question. I like your style man, sarcasm is always good!
doogleef
Well-Known Member
Lucas formula is not an issue causing any problems. I promise u that. It works for millions of growers all over the world it will work for you too. 5/10 lucas is for FLURO. If you are using HID lighting it should be 8/16 always.
Sorry to get off topic but I;m a big proponent of Lucas and see no reason to believe that is causing any issues.
Sorry to get off topic but I;m a big proponent of Lucas and see no reason to believe that is causing any issues.
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