World Of Hempy

MickFoster

Well-Known Member
Here's my opinion about it....Once INERT mediums, grow rocks, wool, etc, have been rinsed and are currently in use, IT SHOULD NOT, really be contributing to that problem...If I had to guess, your starting water is of a more alkali nature....Mixes typically like to buffer a little BACK TOWARD the waters starting pH...ALSO, plants in a rapid growth stage will make pH change...In that case, it's a sign of rapid growth activity...ALSO, how grower feeds can SIGNIFICANTLY make the pH change UP OR DOWN.....I am a light feeder compared to many, and my pH ALWAYS raises over time...Over time can mean in mear hours...Heavy feeding on the other hand will make the pH #'s go down..That is especially true during early flower when a high Phosphorus ACID is in the mix....That higher acid, of course will buffer the #'s down...When mixing flowering nutes, most growers notice that your pH WILL BE lower than mixing with their veg nutes....Its due to the Phosphorus acid.....
NOW, a pH drift to some degree, SHOULD BE WELCOMED...different nutes absorb at different pH values...chasing that PERFECT pH will drive you crazy...
I wouldnt be that concerned about how yours is behaving...YOU DO though, need to understand how it behaves and use that to your advantage......EARLY veg, my Hempy's CAN GET #'s higher than I am comfortable with...I have a small hole drilled in the bottom sides of my bucket (not the 2 inch high drain holes)...I have a rubber stopper in those....A cpl weeks after translating I will SAMPLE a little water that is sitting in the buckets internal reservoirs....Many times, It has creeped up to high 6's and even 7 s yours do....SO, I will flush heavy with a pH correct solution weak in nutes....After that, I turn right around and water with pH AND ppm correct solutions...Just resetting everything....SOMETIMES this isnt necessary, but sometimes it is....I DO understand that mine can do that, so I am prepared to make adjustments....
I ALWAYS feed every watering, but with moderate nute levels...plants enjoy that stability over those who feed, feed, flush type watering programs....This also keeps things less apt to build up or get deficient....Only make nute increases when they want it, not because any charts say they SHOULD need it by then...Not saying your over feeding, but keep things modedate and constant...UNDERSTANDING how your pH behaves will become very clear after a crop (2 at the most), IN THAT PARTICULAR SYSTEM...every system behave differently...Learns your well and dont chase smaller drifts...Maybe water with your pH slightly lower, let it drift up past IDEAL, and rewater when it starts getting too high...I.HAVE ALSO NOTICED all my pH drift (going higher), SLOWS WAY DOWN, once they are a 2-3 weeks into flower...That insane growth of stretch and transition into flower is over and MY pH stablizes much easier......
Hope this doesnt confuse you more than it helped, but you are not alone...pH drift is part of the game....A few variables are involved, but UNDERSTANDING HOW THE PH IN YOUR SYSTEM behaves is the key...Once you know that, you can deal with it, and they will be fine....Welcome a a small controlled drift though instead of chasing it...YT
I appreciate your reply. I understand everything that you said but none of what you described is the problem. My plants are only 9 days old......I run a gallon of a light (1/4 strength) nutes, pH'd to around 5.5 four times a day, and within an hour the pH of the res jumps to 7.0. It's not my water because I've been using my tap water for many years......plus if I let my nute solution sit for a half day or more, the pH doesn't change.

Do you have an explanation for this?
Thanks.
 

yankeetransplant

Well-Known Member
Why is watering 4 times a day?....what is the water pH starting #?...
Also, AFTER your 4 waterings, when it testing at 7.0ph, what is the ppm....I get a quarter strength is light, but if there is a moderate increase in ppms after 4 waterings, that could change the pH....
A light solution can be RE-BUFFERING back toward your waters starting pH...
The tap where I am at is 7.8-7.9....different everywhere though.....Sometimes it helps to figure out what is NOT causing it, to find out what is...YT
 

yankeetransplant

Well-Known Member
One more thing...After determining what your water starting pH is, are you adjusting it after adding nutes, and prior to use...
Figure out starting water pH, then what it is after adding nutes, and how is that be adjusted prior to use...YT
 

yankeetransplant

Well-Known Member
I'm cheap and old school...I use white vinegar for a downer (its organic and 5% acidic), and I use bicarbonate (baking soda) for an upper....Has served me well for DECADES....Both very inexpensive and work great.....
But that has nothing to do with your issue of course....Should be able to figure this one out.....I use 80% perlite mix (20% is vermiculite)...AND, i have use hydroton, lava rock, pea stone for reservoir basins and all worked just fine WITHOUT causing me unusual pH fluctuations....All are fine and stable after rinsed and in use...YT
 

yankeetransplant

Well-Known Member
Really sounds like you already figured out the solution of letting it sit for a bit....I'm guessing your water is alkali and all its doing (with a light solution) is buffering back toward the waters alkali values....I'll bet when your plants are bigger and your mixing higher ppm values, it will be more stable..Out of curiosity, did you check your waters starting pH?.....
 

MickFoster

Well-Known Member
Why is watering 4 times a day?....what is the water pH starting #?...
I'm feeding light nutes 4 times a day until the roots reach the res, then I'll switch to once every other day. Also I'm feeding 4 times at around 5.2 in order to see if I can lower the pH in the medium and the res to normal and stabilized readings. My tap pH is 7.5.
One more thing...After determining what your water starting pH is, are you adjusting it after adding nutes, and prior to use...
Of course. I've been growing over 25 years.....I know that.
Really sounds like you already figured out the solution of letting it sit for a bit...
No, I don't let it sit for a bit. I only mentioned that my pH doesn't change when I let it sit out to provide you with more information about my problem.
I appreciate the effort.
 

gr865

Well-Known Member
I'm feeding light nutes 4 times a day until the roots reach the res, then I'll switch to once every other day. Also I'm feeding 4 times at around 5.2 in order to see if I can lower the pH in the medium and the res to normal and stabilized readings. My tap pH is 7.5.

Of course. I've been growing over 25 years.....I know that.

No, I don't let it sit for a bit. I only mentioned that my pH doesn't change when I let it sit out to provide you with more information about my problem.
I appreciate the effort.
Mick, I have a 27 gallon rez, I make up 21 gallons at a time in two 32 gallon plastic trash can. I fill one with RO water and begin aerating that. I let it aerate for a couple of days the make up a batch of solution, and fill the 2nd can with RO and begin aerating it.
I let the nute solution sit in the can for a couple of days prior to adding it to the rez. I flip/flop the two cans. I note that by letting them sit and stabilize prior to adding to the rez, lessens the pH swing, does not stop it but does not swing as much.
I do not mind pH drift, if i set it to 5.8 at the start of the cycle it will rise to around 5.9. Now I set it to around 5.9 and let it float to around 6 by the end of the irrigation cycles.
I tried House and Garden pH stabilizer, could not get to it do the job.
 
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yankeetransplant

Well-Known Member
Gr865...yours is NICE and stable....mine behaves more like Mick...Early in veg, I will water at about 5.5 AND IT WILL drift up into the low 6's...then when the plants are late veg and thru flower, it MUCH more stable....I've been using tap water for decades, and most of the pH values are like his...Mid to upper 7's.....Even though I get an up drift, It has never mattered....They veg very rapidly, And never show any type of nutrient deficiencies....Its the way my system behaves and I truely believe they enjoy the drift (to a certain degree anyways) since nutes absorb best at different values....Long as you DO KNOW how they behave, its easy to work with....Once they are more established it stablizes anyways, so its also a temporary problem....I dont like making RO water, although I've have in the past...Never saw any benefits over my tap...Then again, I never lived where the tap water is really bad....my taps waters have never gone over 200ppms...Someone once mentioned that S.Cali water has over 500ppm+ out of the tap!!!!...YUK!....
I think Mick's light mixes into a 7.5 water would almost always try to buffer back to being more alkali....Important thing is, he knows how its behaving and I'M SURE that will stablize for him when they are more mature....
I root my cuttings in 8oz styro coffee cups and found I get best results running that pH in the low 6's....A chemist I am not, but they root faster, stay greener while they're rooting, and give me the highest rooting rates (typically 100%).....WHY??IDK?....but I wont try to MAKE THEM run at 5.7 just cause its a standard hydro pH value...LOL...Gotta stick with what works best...Understanding how ones own system behaves....In fact, took the mini domes off this latest batch of cuttings last night....100% and very healthy...YT20191115_015233.jpg20191115_015201.jpg
 

yankeetransplant

Well-Known Member
Hey Mick, I run 20% vermiculite in with 80% Perlite...THE ONLY reason I add the Vermiculite, is so I dont have to water frequently that 1st week or 10 days...In fact, that 20% allows me to go 3 days btwn water, AND ultimately get a larger root ball.....And 20% vermiculite is WAY not enuf to cause WET FEET for the roots....No big deal to water more OFTEN, if you do have the time to tend to them 4 times a day....
I'm sure you have your routine down after 25 yrs of growing...But, in case life does not allow you to be working on them that frequently, Its a good option without compromising the mixes ability to allow the roots to breathe properly....You can layer it too...Straight perlite on top of your hydroton (half way up) and top it off with a 20-25% mix....
ROOTS WILL spread better if they have that little extra moisture to get going...Ultimately your root ball is bigger and wider before getting developed strands dropping into the water....They follow the moisture, and thats why they spread better in a slightly wetter mix.....Splitting hairs???, MAYBE...but I find multiple small improvements add up to larger results.....I use an air stone in mine too...its not needed to grow good bud, BUT I DO SEE a discernable difference with them....Like all little improvements, THEY ADD UP...
Looking forward to some pics when they are big girls...YT
 

MickFoster

Well-Known Member
Hey Mick, I run 20% vermiculite in with 80% Perlite...THE ONLY reason I add the Vermiculite, is so I dont have to water frequently that 1st week or 10 days...In fact, that 20% allows me to go 3 days btwn water, AND ultimately get a larger root ball.....And 20% vermiculite is WAY not enuf to cause WET FEET for the roots....No big deal to water more OFTEN, if you do have the time to tend to them 4 times a day....
I'm sure you have your routine down after 25 yrs of growing...But, in case life does not allow you to be working on them that frequently, Its a good option without compromising the mixes ability to allow the roots to breathe properly....You can layer it too...Straight perlite on top of your hydroton (half way up) and top it off with a 20-25% mix....
ROOTS WILL spread better if they have that little extra moisture to get going...Ultimately your root ball is bigger and wider before getting developed strands dropping into the water....They follow the moisture, and thats why they spread better in a slightly wetter mix.....Splitting hairs???, MAYBE...but I find multiple small improvements add up to larger results.....I use an air stone in mine too...its not needed to grow good bud, BUT I DO SEE a discernable difference with them....Like all little improvements, THEY ADD UP...
Looking forward to some pics when they are big girls...YT
I never knew the importance of the vermiculite for root growth at the beginning. Very informative....thanks. I actually used an 80/20 perlite/vermiculite mix last years grow and I had pH issues then as well at the beginning......I had forgotten.

Do you think my roots will develop properly with my daily feedings for the first couple of weeks? They are growing a little slower than normal......I guess that could be attributed to slow root growth.....but I'm not going to dig them up to find out.

I really appreciate the advice brother.
 

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
have you thought about running some peroxide thru?

maybe you got some root funk causing teh pH rise?

and i did hempys for years and never checked my runoff. i did multi feeds daily from start to finish.
 

MickFoster

Well-Known Member
@MickFoster
i've seen your posts on this hempy thread for years it seems like.

so the first question should be, have you changed anything lately?
Haha, you don't have to remind me that I'm old. (:

It's been many years since I grew in hempy buckets......I did regular hempys with a perlite/vermiculite mix and I also did 100% hydroton once just for laughs......but it's been a while.

Thanks to yankeetransplant I was able to figure out my problem. I wasn't mixing my nute solution ahead of time to allow it to stabilize......I was mixing and using immediately. Since I've been letting it sit for hours to stabilize, I've had no problems with severe pH drift. I'm a dumb ass.

I appreciate your interest and concern brother. :peace:
 

reggie1387

Active Member
Hey fellow growers!
just started my first hempy grow. %100 perlite in 14L (3.6gal) buckets. Automated feeding setup, but since the seedlings are so small I’m hand watering cause I don’t think the halo rings watering reach them.
Got them under my quantum board light frame. 5x 288s, 2x Emerson effect boards. Only the centre 288 is on. Seedlings are loving the light.
Feeding them GH maxibloom (1/GH silica, GH calmag, GH rapid start roots, sourthern Ag fungicide (hydrogaurd) pondzyme.

currently deciding on what growing technique I’ll use. Not sure scrog or supercropping maybe.
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