Zen master's northern light-n-blue venom grow journal

[(Butters)]

ok 1st pic is on the 4th of July i think , i just got the bubbleliccious planted in the slabs and moved to flower room...Madazz

Wow. And I was given myself a hard time about having my screen so far above my plants.

Okay. Questions questions. So you veg normally, letting it go to whatever height it hits in that 2-3 weeks, and put them in that flower room in those slabs. Is that an ebb & flow set up? Love those long trays.

Given the height your screen is above the now flowering plants, you probably have to lollipop the hell outta em right? No need for those pesky little nugget buds that'll inevitably form on the lower parts given there vertical prowess, eh?

How do they do with the bending while in flower there. How many weeks are they when they hit that screen? Does it still force the horizontal growth at that height? How even does that canopy stay? At that size, I imagine those buds get strong and heavy. I would think they'd be able to potentially lift parts of that screen in certain places, disrupting the canopy a bit.

How much room is there between buds on that screen? I'm wondering about adjusting the height of the screen in that same setup you have. By making it a little lower, I would think that it could force the horizontal growth a little sooner, filling the screen even more with even less space in between buds.

Now that I see your set up, I'm thinking about ways to exploit the relationship between having a "master screen" (my word for having 1 screen for multiple plants) relative to factors like height above the plant medium and number of plants. Could make a tall scrog that yields quite a bit more than the traditional shorter ones that are motivated by vertical height restriction.

Those buds look like forearms btw. They're huge! Are you fim'ing/topping or is it just a straight up grow?

Very nice Madazz.

And crap! I just notice that you do have links in your sig. Okay, let me shoot through those and see how many of these s you've already answered.

-Butters

 

[madazz]

Wow. And I was given myself a hard time about having my screen so far above my plants.

Okay. Questions questions. So you veg normally, letting it go to whatever height it hits in that 2-3 weeks, and put them in that flower room in those slabs. Is that an ebb & flow set up? Love those long trays.

These are the trays the COGr slabs come in. (canna slabs) i use 4L/H drippers on a manifold system feeding to each plant. I'd use thepropper COGr slabs if i had a veg room big enough to plant my clones from the 1" rockwool cube to the slabs i'd be using the COGr ones but as my veg room is only 2 small cupbords the slabs dont fit.

Given the height your screen is above the now flowering plants, you probably have to lollipop the hell outta em right? No need for those pesky little nugget buds that'll inevitably form on the lower parts given there vertical prowess, eh?

Yep i do lollie pop them just like this

How do they do with the bending while in flower there. Once they are in the heavy flower stage i dont really bend to much more. its really a support thing by then.

How many weeks are they when they hit that screen? I put the screen on top and threaded the limbs through, when they were moved to flower room and planted in the slabs. they were about 5-6 weeks from seed.

Does it still force the horizontal growth at that height? Yeap sure does here is a pic

How even does that canopy stay? At that size, I imagine those buds get strong and heavy. I would think they'd be able to potentially lift parts of that screen in certain places, disrupting the canopy a bit. They do, i actually have tied a few of the squares together and i tie 1 string in the middle and tie down to tray so it cant push up to much.it still happens in the outer spots a bit.

How much room is there between buds on that screen? I'm wondering about adjusting the height of the screen in that same setup you have. By making it a little lower, I agree i wish i had be able to have it a bit lower,i'm still very happy with the results though. normally by now my room would have fallen over or need to be tied up- which i hate doing.

I would think that it could force the horizontal growth a little sooner, filling the screen even more with even less space in between buds. yeah i would normally have 18 plants there is only 7 of the bubblelicious side thats why it looks so bare, ideally only having 7 i should have vegged longer but unfortunatlly this was not a option.

Now that I see your set up, I'm thinking about ways to exploit the relationship between having a "master screen" (my word for having 1 screen for multiple plants) relative to factors like height above the plant medium and number of plants. Could make a tall scrog that yields quite a bit more than the traditional shorter ones that are motivated by vertical height restriction. I was thinking about putting mesh on both walls in my cupboard and putting a light in vertically and growing them up the wall. i think it would do well. Heath Robinson has some great vert ideas. Its worth taking a look.

Those buds look like forearms btw. They're huge! Are you fim'ing/topping or is it just a straight up grow? i think 4 were topped as they were getting so tall in veg cupboard other 3 are just pulled over in one direction. they are huge long fore arms

Very nice Madazz. THANKS

And crap! I just notice that you do have links in your sig. Okay, let me shoot through those and see how many of these s you've already answered.

yeah bro, check it out.

ZEN MASTER I'M SORRY FOR TAKING OVER YOUR THREAD. LETS GET BACKON TRACK, HOWS THINGS LOOKING?? did anyone email the botanicare sweet grape freebie promo? i posted a few posts ago.

-Butters

MADAZZ

 

[(Butters)]

And now to tie it back to Zen's journal...

Given that you don't have much vertical space restrictions Zen, Madazz's scrog technique makes quite a bit of sense for you. His is a scrog but for MUCH different reasons than a traditional scrog (usually all about height restriction, canopy, and plant #s).

His appears to be more about getting HUGE arm-like buds and having ways to support them along with keeping a relative canopy. Your plants already his height to begin with. His style would barely be a transition for you. Just add lollipopping.

My scrog is much more about limiting plant #s and therefore improving my plant:yield ratio. I'm in a non-legal state. I will eventually play around with doing a true sog with 25 lollipops or so (as discussed with the auto seeds i have). But if I have a choice between getting caught with 2 scrog'd plants or 25 tiny lollipopped plants....I'd much prefer the #2 than the #25 as presented in court. Not sure about the penalties for cultivation in TX, but they probably give people the chair either way.

If you could care less about plant #s, then check out the 1st pic below. Very simple. Minimal horizontal/vertical space used. And the capacity to set up weekly, biweekly, monthly. etc., harvests to remain in constant supply. You've got a good mother room/veg area where you could maintain the moms and take clones on a regular schedule. The op in that picture puts out 9g per clone under just 1 400w. So, if you were to plant one "row" of clones (i.e. 5 clones about 6"-8" inches in height), and harvest them each week, you would (according to that growers technique...which I felt missed some key aspects) harvest 1.5oz every week. That grow used 2L coke bottles in a hempy style grow with perlite and vermiculite..a mistake in my opinion. the yield came out to be 0.5 grams/watt. Doing the same thing with coco and some lollipopping, we'd probably start at 0.7 g/watt and work up from there as we dial it in a bit.

But another scrog you might like is in pics 2 & 3. This is done by WoodsmanToker and as I remember he uses 1 600w hps. That one plant yields something like 4-6oz and the canopy is absolutely perfect...consistent smoke throughout. That's a nice plant:yield ratio there.

Madazz brought up another really good suggestion in his last post. He brought up Heath Robinson's vertical ideas. If you're not familiar with his grows it's quite a site. Long story short, the man gets 2.1 g/watt off of just ONE 600w HPS. Lots of talk of people going vertical soon but I haven't seen too many with success like his. That vertical device pic I included is like an absurd $5500 but I would imagine something similar could be made for pennies.

So many options, so little time.

-Butters

 

[madazz]

I WANT 1! it would pay itself of in the 1st run. Its like the omega garden

Omega garden these are around 3 -5 grand Aus so bit cheaper us.

Madazz

 

[(Butters)]

I WANT 1! it would pay itself of in the 1st run. Its like the omega garden
Madazz

Have you seen any journals with those used yet? I haven't seen any in my travels online.

-Butters

 

[madazz]

Have you seen any journals with those used yet? I haven't seen any in my travels online.

-Butters

No i wish i had i'd be really inerested how much it would really yield. they makers of omega reckon in their system gardenleaf crops such as lettuce that would normally be a 6-8week crop there doing them in under 2 weeks. Now thats FAST! Where's ZEN at ? have we taken over his thread and he got mad and left ? Hope not. Zen We are sorry for posting random shit in your thread. We will try to keep it more on YOUR track.

Madazz

 

[ZEN MASTER]

No i wish i had i'd be really inerested how much it would really yield. they makers of omega reckon in their system gardenleaf crops such as lettuce that would normally be a 6-8week crop there doing them in under 2 weeks. Now thats FAST! Where's ZEN at ? have we taken over his thread and he got mad and left ? Hope not. Zen We are sorry for posting random shit in your thread. We will try to keep it more on YOUR track.

Madazz

greetings and salutations my friends, just took a small break. no not mad at all i'm glad you guys kept my seat warm. bad, awfully sad news though, well not sad, but it is bad. last thursday i bought something to combat my spider mite issues. what it was is kinda like those public bathroom aerosol machines with the metered spray cans that spray like every few minutes or so. well in this instance it was the same machine but instead of air freshener, it contains a sort of insecticide. well long story long, i got every thing together and set up, well friday when i woke up the back HALF of my house smelled like the insecticide. of course i immediately ran to my room to see what was going on. i open the door turn on the light and the whole room is just saturated and cloudy with the contents from the spray can, the leaves of all of my plants were just shining and glistening like they had just been oiled down. upon investigation i found that the machine was the wrong one for that particular can, and some kind of way when it pressed the nozzle down it broke it in mid spray or something because the entire can was empty. now on the upside i did not see not one mite alive. good right, ha ha wrong! saturday evening when my lights turned on i noticed a lot of browning, sunday a lot more browning and a lot of yellowing, and almost all of the pistils were dried up,by sunday it looked like some one had came into my room with a paint ball gun full of yellow paintballs and let about seven or eight shots off into the ceiling and the excess splattered on the plants, well it was about time to feed them so what i did was mixed a light solution together, probably about 40% strength, because i figured i'd give it something to help kind of flush it a little. by tuesday it seemed that the worst was over and all of the damage had stopped, and that they had weathered the storm, but dam they really look like they took a real good beating. upon checking them this morning before lights out i noticed some new pistils growing, and even though they are burned, the leaves LOOK like they are alive and recieving the light pretty good. even though they are looking alright right now, i wonder about what long term effects i might have to deal with as far as yeild, taste, potency , etc.. hopefully they'll be alright(fingers crossed).




P.S. no problem at all with the random post, i have found them all informative, thank you all.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-

 

[ZEN MASTER]

But another scrog you might like is in pics 2 & 3. This is done by WoodsmanToker and as I remember he uses 1 600w hps. That one plant yields something like 4-6oz and the canopy is absolutely perfect...consistent smoke throughout. That's a nice plant:yield ratio there.

Thanks Butters pic #2 is exactly what i'm wanting to achieve, but i will probably do them like madazz and top them in veg and put them under a screen when they go out to flower. what i might do is make the screen with half inch pvc, sort of like a little table with legs about two or three feet high. then i'll get some three quarter, or one inch pvc, and cut four pieces about three feet long, drill some holes bout six inches apart in each one, therefore i'll be able to adjust my screen from three to six feet. so as they grow upwards, instead of putting another screen over them, i can just raise it up, and with the four corners i imagine it will be easy to compensate for an uneven canopy, to a certain degree. we'll see though.in the mean time i need to see if my babies are going to be alright.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-

 

[(Butters)]

Sorry to hear about the disruption of the grow man. The good news, it sounds like they had a brief nute-burn shock and got through it okay.

Do you still have some BV (in veg or clone) that weren't effected. This probably has to effect yield for the ones in flower...to some extent. But, you can always clone, re-veg, and flower to full potential again at least.

Hope you enjoyed the 6 day stretch off. Meanwhile on RIU......Madazz and I concluded that you should include a couple of $5500 pieces of equipment in your low-cost grow.

Glad to hear there are no mites left now. It'll be awhile before any spider mite even THINKS about visiting your grow area after that. The word will be out on the mite-streets about the level of chemical warfare that you are willing to wage.

-Butters

 

[jberry]

try to wash that oil off with plain water... make sure to use those type of sprays when the light cycle is OFF, i suspect the light heated the oil which burned the plant... not the actual excess of the spray.

 

[madazz]

try to wash that oil off with plain water... make sure to use those type of sprays when the light cycle is OFF, i suspect the light heated the oil which burned the plant... not the actual excess of the spray.

Hey Zen, mate hows things? thats sux what happened. i used to use white oil to kill bugs/etc and that leaves the leaves so shinny and glossy i have to wipe them down otherwise thay do burn a little.

What JB said was what i was going to suggest. They will come back i've done a lot worse!

I harvested a few gils last night , check out my journal for some amazing Bud shots.

catch ya'll soon.

Madazz

 

[ZEN MASTER]

try to wash that oil off with plain water... make sure to use those type of sprays when the light cycle is OFF, i suspect the light heated the oil which burned the plant... not the actual excess of the spray.

actually it was the spray itself. the reason i say that is because the clones that i took had some mites on them, and i just let one little spray off in the clone box and they were burned a little bit also, and that's under two 24" cool floros which don't get hot at all . i've had clones that grew up where they were touching the lights and they did'nt burn 'em. so yea it was the spray. but it looks as if things are getting alot better.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-

 

[jberry]

yea it was the oil in the spray with the combination of light and maybe air pollution as well... I have to say i think that the floros could burn leaves with oil on them (oil is used for cooking), i bet if the spray was applied at the dark cycle and then washed away you would have no burn.

Was it a Pyrythium bug bomb? or neem oil?

how much did the bottle/can say to apply and how much did u actually apply??

u cant really use too much of most of those type of sprays as long as you spray when the lights are off and then wash it off.

ive seen someone accidentliy use 600ml instead of 60ml without burn...

oh well, im glad they are making such a fast recovery, it sounded pretty bad.

 

[ZEN MASTER]

yea it was the oil in the spray with the combination of light and maybe air pollution as well... I have to say i think that the floros could burn leaves with oil on them (oil is used for cooking), i bet if the spray was applied at the dark cycle and then washed away you would have no burn.

Was it a Pyrythium bug bomb? or neem oil?

how much did the bottle/can say to apply and how much did u actually apply??

u cant really use too much of most of those type of sprays as long as you spray when the lights are off and then wash it off.

ive seen someone accidentliy use 600ml instead of 60ml without burn...

oh well, im glad they are making such a fast recovery, it sounded pretty bad.

i cant tell you what was in it, i'll have to check the ingredients. what it was was one of those metered spray canisters that you usually see in public restrooms with the little automatic spray dispenser machine. well like i said it was the wrong machine for that container, and it broke it and discharged all of the contents. so yea it was pretty bad, but all is well they are growing new pistils that are nice, and white, and thick. so at least they are growing again. i'll have some new pics up monday.

 

[ZEN MASTER]

Sorry to hear about the disruption of the grow man. The good news, it sounds like they had a brief nute-burn shock and got through it okay.

Do you still have some BV (in veg or clone) that weren't effected. This probably has to effect yield for the ones in flower...to some extent. But, you can always clone, re-veg, and flower to full potential again at least.

Hope you enjoyed the 6 day stretch off. Meanwhile on RIU......Madazz and I concluded that you should include a couple of $5500 pieces of equipment in your low-cost grow.

Glad to hear there are no mites left now. It'll be awhile before any spider mite even THINKS about visiting your grow area after that. The word will be out on the mite-streets about the level of chemical warfare that you are willing to wage.

-Butters

ok, i hope so. but yea man it was real scary for a minute. i mean they were looking so bad after the firstcouple of days that i was seriously considering killing 'em all, so i could save on my time, nutes, and money. but i decided to give them a chance to see if they would snap out of it. thank goodness that they did. now i'm just waiting to see what the long term is going to be. the bright spots are that my clones survived the gas attack(11 of 13)that's one, two so did my two headed monster. put her out to flower last night, she is standing at 29" right now. and three BIG SHOUT OUT to you Butters those pics you gave me had me thinking all last night, and when my head stopped hurting i had it figured out how i was going to run my ScroG. instead of transplanting them into 3gal pots i'm going to keep them i 1gal pots, keep the veg light low to try and promote more nodes, less vertical stretch, top 'em, and do the screen like i said before . because right now i have those nine plants and they have grown to the point where now the whole 3x8 space is being used. so while those finish flowering(5 more weeks), the clones will be vegging, and stacking up nodes. because out of 11 plants 9 are going to flower, an i want about 8-10 shoots on each one, so tha'll give me 72-90 tops(estimate). man if that works out i'll owe it all to you Butters. thanks. but we will see how that goes when the time comes for that. but monday i'll have some pics up.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-

 

[madazz]

HEY ZEN I DIDN'T SEE THIS ON MY JOURNAL SO 2 ANS YOUR Q

Sorry bro didn't even see this from you. i reckon if its cooling down they will love you for putting another 400watts over them. 3 wks into flower isn't to late. it will help support them therefore when lights off and there not reaching for light they wont have to support those heavy buds there fore putting more energy into producing bud growth than trying to hold the buds up. If u understand? i'm really bad at explaining what i mean. Anyway i catch ya soon. Cheers Aaron

Madazz


Quote:
Originally Posted by ZEN MASTER
no freaking way man, how'd you photoshop your head so small man?LOL. dude i know it's a combo of genetics, lights, screen method , etc., but i want to be like you when i grow up. Jesus Christ i know i won't necessarily achieve "those" results, but i'm sold brother. tell me something, i had a mishap with my babies(more on that in my thread), but do you think that i could do some bending of the main branches and put a screen over them? three weeks flower, is it too late? been thinking about putting up a third 400wt light since its going to be getting cooler, so i'll have one on each end and one in the middle. that should ensure that everybody gets enough light. i want to see how that works before i get the two 1000watters. so tell me what you think. also if you know of any threads that can help, please direct. thanks man. oh yea, just one more time for the people in the cheap seats,.... NICE!!


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-

 

[ZEN MASTER]

hey thanks bro, sorry for the absense guys. i had a few new pics to put up, but i accidentially erased them from my phone, so i have to get some more together. but in the mean time i thought i would show you the finished product.
The first four are of the BV.
The next three are of the indica Pheno northern lights(not as good sativa pheno).
the next three are the sativa pheno(at 8wks very up, up high).
now there are only a few pics because these were the originals, the first mothers.
hope you guys enjoy, be back with some updated pics tomorrow.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-

 

[(Butters)]

..........

Very nicely done mate.

Those are some healthy, tasty looking buds you made yourself there. That one NL cola is freakin huge!

Can't wait to see the adjustments that you're gonna make to your set up.

What was your final weight from this harvest shown here?

-Butters

 

[ZEN MASTER]

..........

Very nicely done mate.

Those are some healthy, tasty looking buds you made yourself there. That one NL cola is freakin huge!

Can't wait to see the adjustments that you're gonna make to your set up.

What was your final weight from this harvest shown here?

-Butters

thanks dude. i can't find my notes, but i'll look for them this weekend. it just so happens that i weighed them as they dried an i have it broken down day by day. so i dont want to guess, so i'll hit you with it monday hopefully. but in the mean time bro i got so pics to share.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-

 

[ZEN MASTER]

what up people!got some new pics in. news flash, i have since put up my third light. i had bought a 1000wt set and hooked it up my my two 400's. i going to have to wait till i get another 1000wt set and some cooltubes because man that sum' bitch got hot as hell. so i took it down an hooked up the third 400wt light. now these are just some photos, some side views, aerial views, and bud shots. now a couple of those pics show the damage to the leaves, it may look like it is the light shinning off of the leaves but that is where the spray killed that part of the leaf. i'm not saying burned because those spots are dam near white. like they died from the inside out, but what i did was hit it with a real light nute mix so what ever was being stored in the leaves would be somewhat flushed out. well it worked and as you can see they are coming along pretty well. i think they might have lost about a week of growth though. but i'm very satisfied with where they are right now.


PEACE