About voting for ron paul

Inneedofbuds

Well-Known Member
I tend to believe that if Obama can win Iowa, he can win pretty much anywhere. You are right, Hilary, no chance. Most people I know would much rather vote for a black man than a women, my parents included, and they are old school southerners. Most of the people that are going to be racist enough to not vote black are going to be Republicans anyway, so it really doesn't have too much of an affect.
 

joepro

Well-Known Member
Obama is by far and away the best candidate out of the one's that still have a shot. If you love Ron Paul, you might as well focus your energy on Obama, cause he's the next best thing with a chance.
WHY is Obama the next best candidate?(give me 3 good answers)
I'm from IL,and hes done NOTHING since in office!

We didnt vote for Obama, we voted against the other guy
(bible thumpin hardcore nut, looked to be a set up bringing in this guy from another state, cant remember his name that lost to obama)

Is it Obamas plan of open boarders and free health care that wins you over?
Obamas thought is that the school system just needs more money not reform,is that it?
His Capital Punishment stance?...he for it.
Tax reform? other then raise taxes, nope no reform, is that it?
The mans platform is what?........
 

Inneedofbuds

Well-Known Member
WHY is Obama the next best candidate?(give me 3 good answers)
I'm from IL,and hes done NOTHING since in office!

We didnt vote for Obama, we voted against the other guy
(bible thumpin hardcore nut, looked to be a set up bringing in this guy from another state, cant remember his name that lost to obama)

Is it Obamas plan of open boarders and free health care that wins you over?
Obamas thought is that the school system just needs more money not reform,is that it?
His Capital Punishment stance?...he for it.
Tax reform? other then raise taxes, nope no reform, is that it?
The mans platform is what?........
Let me address your point about not voting for him in IL first. Obama won his senate race by 70%, a landslide victory. You people must have really hated that other guy. Now, as I clearly stated in my previous posts, Dennis Kucinich is my candidate of choice. Let me explain a little something about the American government. The people don't choose the President. Corporations do. The corporations have already narrowed down our choices for us. I'm not sure who you are rooting for, but I am guessing it's Ron Paul. If so, enjoy your time wasted.The way I figure it, I might as well spend some time endorsing a candidate that has a chance in hell at winning. That being said, why do I go for Obama as apposed to Clinton or Edwards, or any Republican?
You've made some clearly excellent points above by asking me rhetorical questions, let me follow up with some elaboration.

Obama believes in a dynamic free market.
He's for universal health care (for some reason this was a negative point to you?)
He promotes wider access to government decision making.
He wants to give more money to schools, $18 billion in fact (again, a negative to you, but I hate to tell you, money is what pays for reform, not magical fairies)
He proposed a cap and trade auction system to restrict carbon emissions and a 10 year program of investments in new energy sources to reduce U.S. dependence on imported oil.
He was an early opponent of the war (not a fair whether opponent like most people)
He's pro choice (my personal belief)
Oh and his tax reform. His plan would eliminate taxes for senior citizens with incomes of less than $50,000 a year, repeal tax cuts said to favor the wealthy, close corporate tax loopholes and restrict offshore tax havens, and simplify filing of income tax returns by pre-filling wage and bank information already collected by the IRS. (What a douche.)
The list goes on...and frankly, I just think he's a bad ass dude. I've read his books, seen him speak. I like the cut of his jib.
Now please, enlighten us all to your candidate of choice.
 

nowstopwhining

Too many brownies
dude im a stoner and all and would love for ron paul to win but there just aint enough of us out there. now when i see somebody with a ron paul sticker on there vehicle i always look to see if they look like tokers and they always are, gotta love pot heads
Ive got my Ron Paul bumper stickers...hahaha
 

nowstopwhining

Too many brownies
Let me address your point about not voting for him in IL first. Obama won his senate race by 70%, a landslide victory. You people must have really hated that other guy. Now, as I clearly stated in my previous posts, Dennis Kucinich is my candidate of choice. Let me explain a little something about the American government. The people don't choose the President. Corporations do. The corporations have already narrowed down our choices for us. I'm not sure who you are rooting for, but I am guessing it's Ron Paul. If so, enjoy your time wasted.The way I figure it, I might as well spend some time endorsing a candidate that has a chance in hell at winning. That being said, why do I go for Obama as apposed to Clinton or Edwards, or any Republican?
You've made some clearly excellent points above by asking me rhetorical questions, let me follow up with some elaboration.

Obama believes in a dynamic free market.
He's for universal health care (for some reason this was a negative point to you?)
He promotes wider access to government decision making.
He wants to give more money to schools, $18 billion in fact (again, a negative to you, but I hate to tell you, money is what pays for reform, not magical fairies)
He proposed a cap and trade auction system to restrict carbon emissions and a 10 year program of investments in new energy sources to reduce U.S. dependence on imported oil.
He was an early opponent of the war (not a fair whether opponent like most people)
He's pro choice (my personal belief)
Oh and his tax reform. His plan would eliminate taxes for senior citizens with incomes of less than $50,000 a year, repeal tax cuts said to favor the wealthy, close corporate tax loopholes and restrict offshore tax havens, and simplify filing of income tax returns by pre-filling wage and bank information already collected by the IRS. (What a douche.)
The list goes on...and frankly, I just think he's a bad ass dude. I've read his books, seen him speak. I like the cut of his jib.
Now please, enlighten us all to your candidate of choice.
Only problem I see with this is that its the kind of thinking that ALWAYS keeps Candidates like Ron Paul from winning.

Lots of supporters everywhere but everyone figures...Oh hes not gonna win anyways so im not gonna waste my time.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE check this out...


Go to ISSUES to see Ron Paul's views on various topics.


Ron Paul 2008 — Hope for America
 

ViRedd

New Member
Inneedofbuds ...

The cut of Obama's "jib" is fine. He's the most articulate of the Democrat candidates that are left in the race. Other than that ... he sucks.

Here's what you said: "Obama believes in a dynamic free market."

Then you followed that up with this:

1. He's for universal health care.

2. He wants to give more money to schools, $18 billion in fact.

3. He proposed a cap and trade auction system to restrict carbon emissions and a 10 year program of investments in new energy sources to reduce U.S. dependence on imported oil.

This doesn't sound like a guy who believes in a dynamic free market to me. Please explain. Thanks ...

Vi

 

WillieNelson

Well-Known Member
Obama is by far and away the best candidate out of the one's that still have a shot. If you love Ron Paul, you might as well focus your energy on Obama, cause he's the next best thing with a chance.
Ecept the two canidates have almost nothing in common. The closest conservative canidate to Paul is Fred Thompson. :joint:
 

Inneedofbuds

Well-Known Member
Inneedofbuds ...

The cut of Obama's "jib" is fine. He's the most articulate of the Democrat candidates that are left in the race. Other than that ... he sucks.

Here's what you said: "Obama believes in a dynamic free market."

Then you followed that up with this:

1. He's for universal health care.

2. He wants to give more money to schools, $18 billion in fact.

3. He proposed a cap and trade auction system to restrict carbon emissions and a 10 year program of investments in new energy sources to reduce U.S. dependence on imported oil.

This doesn't sound like a guy who believes in a dynamic free market to me. Please explain. Thanks ...

Vi
To be honest, I am not really sure what you mean. Not being a smart ass or anything, I just dont know how to make a counter point because I don't get yours. I don't see how free health care is restricting a market economy any. All the same jobs will still exist, the government will just be flipping the bill. Giving more money to schools? This isn't like the government saying build more Blockbusters. This is a basic fundamental need of our country. We have a terrible education system. It's a fact. As far as the cap and trade auction system, are you unfamiliar with the system all together, or do you just think it is restricting free markets? Obama's own website can probably explain it better than I can.

What’s important to note is that we’re implementing a 100% auction of cap-and-trade credits. This has the same effect as carbon tax—because it raises the costs of polluting and everyone has to pay. The benefit of this is that it’s more flexible and market driven.
The government is susceptible to lobbying from oil companies and coal companies and if the government is setting a price through a carbon tax, they’ll be subject to these pressures.
We’ll also need perfect information to determine the right price. How much will ensure companies don’t just continue polluting? How much is enough to not hurt consumers?
The government isn’t the perfect analyst of what to do here. This is an area in which market forces can create better results.

So, as you can see, the exact point of this system is to be market driven.
The same goes with reducing imported oil. Self reliance will create more jobs for the American people and cheaper energy. I hope that answers your question.
 

joepro

Well-Known Member
Let me address your point about not voting for him in IL first. Obama won his senate race by 70%, a landslide victory. You people must have really hated that other guy. Now, as I clearly stated in my previous posts, Dennis Kucinich is my candidate of choice. Let me explain a little something about the American government. The people don't choose the President. Corporations do. The corporations have already narrowed down our choices for us. I'm not sure who you are rooting for, but I am guessing it's Ron Paul. If so, enjoy your time wasted.The way I figure it, I might as well spend some time endorsing a candidate that has a chance in hell at winning. That being said, why do I go for Obama as apposed to Clinton or Edwards, or any Republican?
You've made some clearly excellent points above by asking me rhetorical questions, let me follow up with some elaboration.

Obama believes in a dynamic free market.
He's for universal health care (for some reason this was a negative point to you?)
He promotes wider access to government decision making.
He wants to give more money to schools, $18 billion in fact (again, a negative to you, but I hate to tell you, money is what pays for reform, not magical fairies)
He proposed a cap and trade auction system to restrict carbon emissions and a 10 year program of investments in new energy sources to reduce U.S. dependence on imported oil.
He was an early opponent of the war (not a fair whether opponent like most people)
He's pro choice (my personal belief)
Oh and his tax reform. His plan would eliminate taxes for senior citizens with incomes of less than $50,000 a year, repeal tax cuts said to favor the wealthy, close corporate tax loopholes and restrict offshore tax havens, and simplify filing of income tax returns by pre-filling wage and bank information already collected by the IRS. (What a douche.)
The list goes on...and frankly, I just think he's a bad ass dude. I've read his books, seen him speak. I like the cut of his jib.
Now please, enlighten us all to your candidate of choice.

starting teacher pay in CPS is $36,231, and top pay is $64,464, for a 40-week year with a 5% raise in 08.
The school system is broken, just take a look at worlds test scores and the pay thoes teachers make.
Chinese full-time teachers, a status that carries a pay-packet of 2,000 yuan (U.S.$270) a month.
I believe money is not the reform it needs and infact adds to the issues that has never been address.
Reform backed by money, I totaly agree. money is the reform,I couldnt disagree more.Thinking like that got us here in the first place, we need real reform.

Outside of the media, who told you whos winning what?
No dude, my vote isnt wasted, while some like yourself are voting along the partylines and letting the media tell you reality.some of us will hold to are convictions and don't rely on the media to weed out the top three for us cattle.-again thinking like that got us here in the first place.

Health care
Yes its needed, but I have no trust in a goverment run health care system(i.e. school system)The poor already have a crappy free health care system its called medicare.

You think he a bad ass dude and you have read his books, thats um great reasons to vote for him.
I see you danced around the open boarder issue, just that reason alone you should rethink your position,being an american born great-great grandson whos a laborer this is such a big issue for me and for you to blow it off gets under my skin.

I'm gona do the right thing and vote RP and be apart of the 6%.
 

nowstopwhining

Too many brownies
starting teacher pay in CPS is $36,231, and top pay is $64,464, for a 40-week year with a 5% raise in 08.
The school system is broken, just take a look at worlds test scores and the pay thoes teachers make.
Chinese full-time teachers, a status that carries a pay-packet of 2,000 yuan (U.S.$270) a month.
I believe money is not the reform it needs and infact adds to the issues that has never been address.
Reform backed by money, I totaly agree. money is the reform,I couldnt disagree more.Thinking like that got us here in the first place, we need real reform.

Outside of the media, who told you whos winning what?
No dude, my vote isnt wasted, while some like yourself are voting along the partylines and letting the media tell you reality.some of us will hold to are convictions and don't rely on the media to weed out the top three for us cattle.-again thinking like that got us here in the first place.

Health care
Yes its needed, but I have no trust in a goverment run health care system(i.e. school system)The poor already have a crappy free health care system its called medicare.

You think he a bad ass dude and you have read his books, thats um great reasons to vote for him.
I see you danced around the open boarder issue, just that reason alone you should rethink your position,being an american born great-great grandson whos a laborer this is such a big issue for me and for you to blow it off gets under my skin.

I'm gona do the right thing and vote RP and be apart of the 6%.
So will I!

Vote For Ron Paul!
 

nowstopwhining

Too many brownies
Well I am a huge supporter of Ron Paul and made a nice donation to his campaign. I recieved this letter since donators become subscribed to his newsletter.

EVERYONE should go and donate even if you only want to donate a dollar it still helps!

Ron Paul is a GREAT candidate not only because of his views on marijuana, but because of his plans for this nation! Ron Paul will protect our privacy and civil liberties, his voting records are proof. Unlike all of the other candidates he votes how he claims he will. Some of the other candidates have said they are against the war or against this and that, but there voting is always contradicting what they say, Not Ron Paul he is a man of his word.

"January 10, 2008


Did you see that funny YouTube where Mike Huckabee's young Iowa spokesman
endorsed me, "by mistake"? We know what was in his mind! Indeed, I am amazed at
the friendliness of the supporters of other candidates. Many
Obama voters, for example, in Iowa and New Hampshire are reading our literature,
and studying our ideas. It's just one of the reasons I am so optimistic about
what we are doing, and where we are heading. And so were the
500 or 600 people at our New Hampshire rally after the primary. I talked to
everyone there, and they are rightly enthusiastic about our movement.

This does not mean we will have an easy time of it -- just the opposite, of
course. After all, we are seeking to reverse more than a century of big
government, of the warfare-welfare state, of Federal Reserve's dollar
manipulation, of a fat and happy military-industrial complex, of the subversion
of our Constitution. So all the media and other "second-hand dealers in ideas,"
as F.A. Hayek called them, who have a vested interest in the current order, will
do everything possible to smear me. They will do and say anything to try to
block our movement. Even vote fraud is not beyond these people.

And we have been successful. This movement has always operated on two tracks --
intellectual and political, and must. The first and most important is the
intellectual. Such heroes of freedom as Ludwig von Mises, Hayek, Henry Hazlitt,
Murray Rothbard, and so many others like Rose Wilder Lane, John T. Flynn, Isabel
Patterson, and Garret Garrett, have helped build the foundations of freedom,
prosperity, and peace. We carry on their work, to change hearts and minds.

The other track is political. Here too, we have touched millions with our ideas,
and recruited many, many thousands -- not only in Meetup Groups and as voters,
but as sympathizers and future voters too. Walter Block
was kind enough to call this effort the most important in the long history of
libertarianism. I don't know about that, but I do know that even if we place a
solid fourth, rather than the higher place we all want and are working so hard
for, that is huge progress.

But we can never forget that this is a long struggle. Many great men and women
have lived and died in this cause. I have been deeply involved in it all my
life. It is a matter of educational work, and elections. We may not accomplish
all we want, in one or even two elections. But we will accomplish it. Young
people now living will see the free society that you and I dream of, as their
everyday reality, an America at peace, prosperous and free, with the federal
government chained down y the Constitution, as Jefferson said.

Does this mean our campaign has done everything right? No! We have made
mistakes, and will make them again. Not only because errors are to be found in
any human endeavor, but because an effort like this, to repeal a hundred years
and more of evil, is brand-new on the face of the earth. But now is the time to
stick together like the brothers and sisters we are, to stand side by side in
this fight against the media toadies, warmongers, and Wall Street rip-off
artists who stand against us, and who always remind me of Tolkein's Orcs.

If you have suggestions for me to do better, I want to hear them. But beating
back the enemy, teaching so many young people and others about liberty, that is
our victory, and it is real and permanent. Won't you link arms with me? We will
have more vote victories too, if we stick together and do not let the enemy
divide us.

As you know, and as our neocon enemies try to cover up, we are in a financial
crisis. It may chug along at this pace, slowly into recession, or it might drop
off a cliff, like the dollar. In that case, we will have the only coherent
solution, and we must get our message out.

All my life, I've been working to make sure that when the Fed had done its work,
and the special interests had looted the system to their hearts' content, and
there was a crisis, I would be in a position to speak the truth about why, and
what to do about it. In this fight, I need your heart, your mind, your time, and
your financial support. I also need you to become a precinct leader
https://voters.ronpaul2008.com/grassroots/ . What a fight we are in. What stakes
there are. Together, we can build a new America faithful to the values of the
framers. Bother the enemy, help the good cause: make your most generous
contribution https://www.ronpaul2008.com/donate/, and let's roll up our sleeves
and get to work, together.

Sincerely,

Ron"



Heres his views on Privacy and civil Liberties.


"The biggest threat to your privacy is the government. We must drastically limit the ability of government to collect and store data regarding citizens’ personal matters. We must stop the move toward a national ID card system. All states are preparing to issue new driver’s licenses embedded with “standard identifier” data — a national ID. A national ID with new tracking technologies means we’re heading into an Orwellian world of no privacy. I voted against the Real ID Act in March of 2005.
To date, the privacy focus has been on identity theft. It was Congress that created this danger by mandating use of the standard identifier (currently your SSN) in the private sector. For example, banks use SSNs as customer account identifiers because the government requires it.
We must also protect medical privacy. Right now, you’re vulnerable. Under so-called “medical privacy protection” rules, insurance companies and other entities have access to your personal medical information.
Financial privacy? Right now depositing $10,000 or more in cash in your local bank account will generate a federally-mandated report to the Financial Crimes Enforcement Network at the United States Department of the Treasury.
And then there’s the so-called Patriot Act. As originally proposed, it:
  • Expanded the federal government’s ability to use wiretaps without judicial oversight;
  • Allowed nationwide search warrants non-specific to any given location, nor subject to any local judicial oversight;
  • Made it far easier for the government to monitor private internet usage;
  • Authorized “sneak and peek” warrants enabling federal authorities to search a person’s home, office, or personal property without that person’s knowledge; and
  • Required libraries and bookstores to turn over records of books read by their patrons.
I have fought this fight for many years. I sponsored a bill to overturn the Patriot Act and have won some victories, but today the threat to your liberty and privacy is very real. We need leadership at the top that will prevent Washington from centralizing power and private data about our lives."


Heres his views on War and Foreign policy

"The war in Iraq was sold to us with false information. The area is more dangerous now than when we entered it. We destroyed a regime hated by our direct enemies, the jihad's, and created thousands of new recruits for them. This war has cost more than 3,000 American lives, thousands of seriously wounded, and hundreds of billions of dollars. We must have new leadership in the White House to ensure this never happens again.
Both Jefferson and Washington warned us about entangling ourselves in the affairs of other nations. Today, we have troops in 130 countries. We are spread so thin that we have too few troops defending America. And now, there are new calls for a draft of our young men and women.
We can continue to fund and fight no-win police actions around the globe, or we can refocus on securing America and bring the troops home. No war should ever be fought without a declaration of war voted upon by the Congress, as required by the Constitution.
Under no circumstances should the U.S. again go to war as the result of a resolution that comes from an unelected, foreign body, such as the United Nations.
Too often we give foreign aid and intervene on behalf of governments that are despised. Then, we become despised. Too often we have supported those who turn on us, like the Kosovars who aid Islamic terrorists, or the Afghan jihad's themselves, and their friend Osama bin Laden. We armed and trained them, and now we’re paying the price.
At the same time, we must not isolate ourselves. The generosity of the American people has been felt around the globe. Many have thanked God for it, in many languages. Let us have a strong America, conducting open trade, travel, communication, and diplomacy with other nations."

IF all of this isn't enough to make you vote Ron Paul then I dont know what to say other than check out RONPAUL2008.COM

Ron paul said that even though he may not win he is still very proud of the fact that he has helped start a movement. This shows that unlike most candidates he is not in this just to win it for HIMSELF
 

Inneedofbuds

Well-Known Member
starting teacher pay in CPS is $36,231, and top pay is $64,464, for a 40-week year with a 5% raise in 08.
The school system is broken, just take a look at worlds test scores and the pay thoes teachers make.
Chinese full-time teachers, a status that carries a pay-packet of 2,000 yuan (U.S.$270) a month.
I believe money is not the reform it needs and infact adds to the issues that has never been address.
Reform backed by money, I totaly agree. money is the reform,I couldnt disagree more.Thinking like that got us here in the first place, we need real reform.

Outside of the media, who told you whos winning what?
No dude, my vote isnt wasted, while some like yourself are voting along the partylines and letting the media tell you reality.some of us will hold to are convictions and don't rely on the media to weed out the top three for us cattle.-again thinking like that got us here in the first place.

Health care
Yes its needed, but I have no trust in a goverment run health care system(i.e. school system)The poor already have a crappy free health care system its called medicare.

You think he a bad ass dude and you have read his books, thats um great reasons to vote for him.
I see you danced around the open boarder issue, just that reason alone you should rethink your position,being an american born great-great grandson whos a laborer this is such a big issue for me and for you to blow it off gets under my skin.

I'm gona do the right thing and vote RP and be apart of the 6%.
When intelligence fails, try BIG BOLD LETTERS!

You're going to make a point about American salaries by comparing us to China? Why don't you compare them to other American jobs?

And yes, your vote is wasted. Ron Paul can not win the election. He will not win, he won't even get close, I'll doubt he'll get the 6% you claim. Good job on sticking with your morals, I prefer my vote to count.

I can understand you not trusting a government health care system, but ours cant get any worse, so I'm for taking a shot at change.

As far as skirting the question about immigration. I didn't skirt it, you were wrong, so I ignored it. He's not for "opening the borders" as you so eliquently called it. That's what ignorant people say when they are trying to bash his policy. You should read it Immigration Rallies | U.S. Senator Barack Obama.
What he is for is supporting those who have worked legally under corporations who hired them illegally. I live in Texas. I am a minority in this state because of the Mexican immigration. I understand the immigration dispute as well as anyone. Let me remind you, that we are an immigrant nation, founded on the work of immigrants, such as the Chinese who built our railroads, and now the Mexicans who build our houses, buildings, give us fast food, mow our lawns, and do basically every other shit job that we want too much money to do.
 

ViRedd

New Member
To be honest, I am not really sure what you mean. Not being a smart ass or anything, I just dont know how to make a counter point because I don't get yours. I don't see how free health care is restricting a market economy any. All the same jobs will still exist, the government will just be flipping the bill. Giving more money to schools? This isn't like the government saying build more Blockbusters. This is a basic fundamental need of our country. We have a terrible education system. It's a fact. As far as the cap and trade auction system, are you unfamiliar with the system all together, or do you just think it is restricting free markets? Obama's own website can probably explain it better than I can.

What’s important to note is that we’re implementing a 100% auction of cap-and-trade credits. This has the same effect as carbon tax—because it raises the costs of polluting and everyone has to pay. The benefit of this is that it’s more flexible and market driven.
The government is susceptible to lobbying from oil companies and coal companies and if the government is setting a price through a carbon tax, they’ll be subject to these pressures.
We’ll also need perfect information to determine the right price. How much will ensure companies don’t just continue polluting? How much is enough to not hurt consumers?
The government isn’t the perfect analyst of what to do here. This is an area in which market forces can create better results.

So, as you can see, the exact point of this system is to be market driven.
The same goes with reducing imported oil. Self reliance will create more jobs for the American people and cheaper energy. I hope that answers your question.
Thanks for the reply ... much appreciated. :)

Let's take the medical and schools. A dynamic free market would eliminate government from these two entities.

If what you meant by universal health care is a government funded socialized medical system ... that is socialized medicine and not a free market driven system. During the Democrat debate last night, Edwards admitted that the wait for major treatment in our VA hospitals is sometimes eight months to a year.

On the schools ... A free market in the school system would entail privatizing the school systems, creating competition among schools, and the schools being run for profit. Obama wants to pump more money into the failed existing system because he wants the support of the NEA ... the Teacher's Union.

Vi
 

Inneedofbuds

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the reply ... much appreciated. :)

Let's take the medical and schools. A dynamic free market would eliminate government from these two entities.

If what you meant by universal health care is a government funded socialized medical system ... that is socialized medicine and not a free market driven system. During the Democrat debate last night, Edwards admitted that the wait for major treatment in our VA hospitals is sometimes eight months to a year.

On the schools ... A free market in the school system would entail privatizing the school systems, creating competition among schools, and the schools being run for profit. Obama wants to pump more money into the failed existing system because he wants the support of the NEA ... the Teacher's Union.

Vi
ok, i get where you're coming from now. I think your point is that you can't have it both ways. If you believe in a free market driven system than you must be on the complete right. I don't really believe this to be true. Like most people in this race, Obama is somewhere in between. Someone you would be describing would be like Augusto Pinochet, who was literally prepared to sanction mass killings for the sake of an free market. He was the ultimate right wing, he was also a nutjob. Saying you believe in a free market doesn't mean you have to ignore the rules of common sense and morality. That's exactly the core of Obama's message. He believes in a free market while keeping the NEEDS of the American people met. Both of your points address the extreme right, and like most candidates, he is not at the extreme of either ends. I posted it above, but here again is a chart that gives you a snap shot of political views. You can clearly see that although Obama is on the authoritarian right, he is almost in the middle, which explains his viewpoints on a free market with universal healthcare and more money for schools. Presidential Candidates on the Political Compass « Reasonable Minds
 

joepro

Well-Known Member
quote from the Obama link givin

On the other hand, to those who are (?)fearful of these immigrants, in some cases because(?)a loss of control for the country and its borders, I would just say to them that we can't have a country in which you have a servant class that is picking our lettuce or plucking our chickens or looking after our children or mowing our lawns (?)but who never have the full rights and obligations of citizenship. That's just not the kind of country that I want to have my children grow up in and my hope is that over the coming months we can come up with the kind of (?)comprehensive, thoughtful legislation that I think the Senate bill reflects and we can have strong border security, we can have employers do the right thing by hiring those who are here(?) legally in some fashion, but that we also provide all those families

Thats enough reasons for me not to vote for Obama.
 
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