Gun control is coming

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
Quote me the entire second, it was explicitly for communal defense purposes, as in militia, and that evolved into the national guard.

You are right about swords, so we will add it to the list of other forbidden arms guaranteed by the constitution yet regulated out of public existence by federal law.
from memory,
A well-regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

Militia simple meant all free men of draftable age. It was a demographic criterion, so the military is never mentioned or invoked.

Also, well-regulated meant something other than it means today.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
from memory,
A well-regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

Militia simple meant all free men of draftable age. It was a demographic criterion, so the military is never mentioned or invoked.

Also, well-regulated meant something other than it means today.
Well-regulated militia implies an army, like Ukrainian territorials are today and under the command and control of the civil government. Private individuals owned canon and had bombs when the second was written and the brits had rockets too, then there are swords and a variety of other fighting weapons used at the time. You can walk down the street open carry with an AR15, but not wearing a sword! :lol: Don't be absurd!
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Let me get this straight for those from open carry states, does it also mean you can wear a sword in public for self-defense? If so, fine swords might come back into fashion among gentlemen and sports coats suitably modified. I mean it would be utterly absurd to ban swords in public while allowing open carry for AR15s. It's regressive enough, so it should appeal to the right, so get ready for swords to come back into fashion and fencing as a sport of choice.
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
Well-regulated militia implies an army,
no; in the beginning the US had no professional or standing army. The militia designation was so that likely draftees could maintain some skill with their arms.
like Ukrainian territorials are today and under the command and control of the civil government. Private individuals owned canon and had bombs when the second was written and the brits had rockets too, then there are swords and a variety of other fighting weapons used at the time. You can walk down the street open carry with an AR15, but not wearing a sword! :lol: Don't be absurd!
which is why I point out that not only the social setting but the terminology has changed. Well-regulated had a relevant meaning more like “in good tune”.

I agree that the amendment as written is largely obsolete. However, wishful revisionism like the above hinders the overall goal of aligning weapons policy with current reality.
 

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
from memory,
A well-regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

Militia simple meant all free men of draftable age. It was a demographic criterion, so the military is never mentioned or invoked.

Also, well-regulated meant something other than it means today.
I have always interpreted that to mean that all able bodied men in an area were required to participate in the local militia, as there was no national guard, no one to call for help that would not take days, if not weeks to arrive. That militia would have a leader, a trainer, who regulated their actions...and who would willingly comply with the proper authorities, if and when they ever arrived. The only reason those people were given the right to keep and bear arms was to act as that militia, which is not only no longer necessary, but is actually detrimental in nearly all cases now.
There is no sane, rational reason for common people to own most of the weapons being sold today.
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
I have always interpreted that to mean that all able bodied men in an area were required to participate in the local militia, as there was no national guard, no one to call for help that would not take days, if not weeks to arrive. That militia would have a leader, a trainer, who regulated their actions...and who would willingly comply with the proper authorities, if and when they ever arrived. The only reason those people were given the right to keep and bear arms was to act as that militia, which is not only no longer necessary, but is actually detrimental in nearly all cases now.
There is no sane, rational reason for common people to own most of the weapons being sold today.
I don’t know how they ran things back then. I don’t remember reading about mandatory peacetime training, but that doesn’t mean they didn’t. However, wouldn’t they then have a status less of a militia and more of a reserve?
 

Drop That Sound

Well-Known Member
Someone is gonna make a fortune selling railguns to criminals if they ban semi auto rifles. Better ban lithium batteries while were at it!
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
no; in the beginning the US had no professional or standing army. The militia designation was so that likely draftees could maintain some skill with their arms.
which is why I point out that not only the social setting but the terminology has changed. Well-regulated had a relevant meaning more like “in good tune”.

I agree that the amendment as written is largely obsolete. However, wishful revisionism like the above hinders the overall goal of aligning weapons policy with current reality.
They had the continental army before that and a fellow named George commanded it, why he even enforced vaccination on his troops!

1791

Second Amendment, amendment to the Constitution of the United States, adopted in 1791 as part of the Bill of Rights, that provided a constitutional check on congressional power under Article I Section 8 to organize, arm, and discipline the federal militia.


Second Amendment | Text, Meaning, Definition, & History
 

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
I don’t know how they ran things back then. I don’t remember reading about mandatory peacetime training, but that doesn’t mean they didn’t. However, wouldn’t they then have a status less of a militia and more of a reserve?
reserve to what? there wasn't even much of a standing army when the amendment was added, if i recall correctly.
it seems a matter of semantics, anyway, they were all they had, with no one to call on that could arrive in time to make a difference....THEY needed weapons handy...fat asses with local police, fire departments, and national guard units readily available do NOT.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Someone is gonna make a fortune selling railguns to criminals if they ban semi auto rifles. Better ban lithium batteries while were at it!
Why not, let's play whackamole! The average gun owner is a moron with a sub 100 IQ, this is a fact, most smart people don't own guns, about 35% of the population does, so it adds up statistically. These people generally don't have the brains to construct a railgun or 3D print one and most have limited resources as well as intelligence. Just 3% of the population owns 50% of the guns and when the regular folks turn theirs's in, what is left will be much easier to deal with. Though I expect robodog will come out of the rubble of a few houses carrying a gun in its jaw pincers, and some might even have cold dead hands attached to them.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
criminals won’t follow the gun laws to begin with. See Chicago, Los Angeles, Atlanta, or say……the entire country of Mexico
That's what prisons are for, and it will make it much easier to put them in one, get caught with a gun and go to prison for serious time, apples to everyone, including "criminals", but they get more time. So, if you've been busted for a DUI and get caught with a gun more time.
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
They had the continental army before that and a fellow named George commanded it, why he even enforced vaccination on his troops!

1791

Second Amendment, amendment to the Constitution of the United States, adopted in 1791 as part of the Bill of Rights, that provided a constitutional check on congressional power under Article I Section 8 to organize, arm, and discipline the federal militia.

Second Amendment | Text, Meaning, Definition, & History
After the war they disbanded the army.
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Looks like the far left in Oregon see the writing on the wall with Measure 114 and realize that it's likely not going to get past the courts. So now they're trying to do it through the State Legislature where it will likely pass and still end up stopped by the courts.

It also looks like they're trying to raise the fees as well so they can raise more money to waste on all of their failed programs that are nothing more than funneling money to the well connected. Grifters all of them.

"The bill would increase the fees to apply for a gun permit from a local police department or sheriff’s office from $65, as set out in Measure 114, to $150 and to $110 for a renewal permit."





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Measure 114 Is not dead in the courts, it's stalled by a hick judge in a hick county. He's doing what illiberal conservatives always do when the majority has spoken, he's slowed it down but eventually has to issue a final ruling so that it can move to the higher courts.

Have you even read what's in that bill? Probably not. There is nothing in that bill that is unconstitutional. It does not prevent a coward from buying a gun to satisfy their craven fear. It simply calls for a permit to buy a gun. In order to get the permit, the prospective buyer would need to have completed a gun safety class within the past five years. It imposes a limit to the number of rounds in a cartridge to 10 but that only affects sales, not ones already in a gun owner's possession. It also closes the gun show loophole and other loopholes that enable people who are not legally allowed a gun to buy them without the background check.

The judge in Harney county has ruled that those reasonable and sane regulations would prevent a person who is not a convict from owning a gun. He knows his ruling will be overturned, which is why he tied it up in his hick county.

So, good on the state legislature for pushing this measure forward. And cry me a fucking river over the cost of the permit to buy a gun. The permit is good for five years.
 
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