Led Growing Is The Way Of The Future My Friends

Harrekin

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
eyecandi said:
it puts out heat, but my room is in my garage and it's winter still, so I'm not saying it's thermal neutral at all. and for CO2, I open the door a couple times during lights on and will be adding an exhale bag shortly to boost CO2. dunno what to tell ya, i specifically recorded outdoor temps, garage room temps and flowering room temps to compare. maybe the difference is between magnetic and digital/electronic ballasts - i only had a magnetic to test with and most digi's run a bit cooler, but i don't know how much the difference would be (enough for a 10deg swing?)

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Thats far from sealed bro, it's got excellent passive ventilation which may not be able to handle the quick build up and maintenance of HID temperatures but is able to successfully vent the indirect radiant heat from LEDs.

So yes they work in your situation, but if you put them in the wardrobe or a small cabinet and sealed it the temps would go insane.

Hence why I said yes they run cooler than HIDs with ventilation, but to say they run cooler than an air cooled HID in a sealed room with no environmental ventilation is just wrong.

You get me? Cos people do run totally sealed insulated rooms, and without ventilation or AC they'd be mighty disappointed with the LEDs based on your statement.
 
eyecandi

eyecandi

Well-Known Member
few growers run 'clean room' sealed grows (and they require a lot more design work then most people think). that room has about as much ventilation as a closet does, less even because the door is weather sealed to prevent light leaks. that's why i need to get the CO2 going, but that is not relevant to the heat loads. would it work by itself in a grow cabinet without ventilation? nope. a closet, i believe so, but would still ventilate or add CO2 to match temps/metabolic rates. I'm an old HID nut and have been sold on em forever. LEDs are new and I'm not sold on em yet myself, but so far I'm happy. I'll find out next month if the buds are any match for a 600.
 
Harrekin

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
eyecandi said:
few growers run 'clean room' sealed grows (and they require a lot more design work then most people think). that room has about as much ventilation as a closet does, less even because the door is weather sealed to prevent light leaks. that's why i need to get the CO2 going, but that is not relevant to the heat loads. would it work by itself in a grow cabinet without ventilation? nope. a closet, i believe so, but would still ventilate or add CO2 to match temps/metabolic rates. I'm an old HID nut and have been sold on em forever. LEDs are new and I'm not sold on em yet myself, but so far I'm happy. I'll find out next month if the buds are any match for a 600.
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The issue isn't whether the perform as well, just the claim that they're cooler to run than a 255cfm air cooled 400w is ridiculous, the glass wouldn't even heat up slightly on the cooltube with that sort of extraction.
 
S

swirley2k

Member
eyecandi Leds do put out as much heat and the reason you probably have less temps than your 600w hps is because your led is only 400w. You could have just switched to a 400w hps and would have reduced heat.. and had a higher yeild.
 
eyecandi

eyecandi

Well-Known Member
SG602 = 3amps
600w = 3amps

tell me where the difference is again?

Harekin - this is the first mention of aircooled. I never said anything about aircooled. I'm saying "My 602 has a lower heat load in the room by itself, then a 600w HID w/ballast does in the exact same space. no venting, no cooling, no ac. period." this is what my room is telling me, i have no reason to make the shit up and would be running the HID if it did it's job without me dumping another $500-1000 into a split-air AC solution.

yup ... just checked the room after being sealed all nite and the light running, all night. 79deg still. 43deg outdoor temps.
 
eyecandi

eyecandi

Well-Known Member
ok, you come check out the room and tell me it's not sealed. double layer of 3/8" on top, 3/8" on all sides, door weather sealed (including the bottom), all cracks/seams sealed with silicon. the only possible place for 'passive ventilation' is the back wall with pegboard - but the spaces behind it have R15 insulation (that is the back wall to the garage). the only place air can possibly enter is under the walls where there is under 1/16" gap in a couple places. that is not passive ventilation, no matter how you twist it.
 
Harrekin

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
Senseimilla said:
Doesn't really matter what you say eyecandi he doesn't get it/want to hear it.
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Excuse me? So stating that 400w of electricity puts out the same heat regardless of source is "not getting it".

Im buying LEDs as supplementary lighting next grow so don't take this the wrong way, but most LED users are in some kind of fantasy that their lights somehow completely defy the laws of physics... which they clearly don't.
 
curly604

curly604

Well-Known Member
herrekin!!!! what is up my long lost brotha !!!!! very cool to see you are some what making the switch to leds ..... i remember the early days :D we have een in this thread for some time havent we , please please again it dont matter if we dont get along or dont agree can we please keep it civil here folks? this thread is meant to further the knowledge of leds and led growing that is it ...... read the first 20-40 posts theres enough crap in this thread lets keep it together fellas :D
 
Senseimilla

Senseimilla

Well-Known Member
I'm going off real world results of the HID in my cab vs. LED, not hypotheticals. I don't disagree with you on a theoretical basis. I'm saying on a practical basis the fixtures either put off less heat or vent it better without extra ventilation that is required by HID. Remember LEDs have cooling and heat sinks built in. I'm not saying they're magic. If you want to duplicate comparing multiple LEDs to similar HID we can talk. Unless you've got any PRACTICAL experience to tell me I'm wrong I can't really go with your 'theoretical' argument over what is going on IN my grow room. Yes, it may be that my ventilation or the other guys is shitty. But that means LEDs perform better in a shittily ventilated environment. Whatever reason, MY environment is cooler with the LEDs at higher wattage and no extra ventilation than a 400w HID with a fan attached. My HID was IN a cooltube but both sides were not vented through (only one end, with air coming in one side of the cooltube and the other venting out the cab) -- I'm not saying LEDs are cooler than a properly ventilated cooltube. I'm saying these LEDs are less heat than ANY similar HID system that don't have a lot of ventilation equipment added (ducting, fans, etc). When you have something to show me in your grow room that contradicts this, I'll listen to you. Until then, please realize not everyone has the space or wants to add a shitload of ventilation equipment to a MICROCAB that's supposed to be for stealth and doesn't have a lot of space for extras. Everyone told me I'll have tons of heat problems with too many LEDs. I have 4 LEDs in the same space as my 400w, running almost the wattage of a 600w light and there's less heat in the same space under the same conditions as the 400w WITH ventilation. So YOU tell me how that happens??? Turn off the fan on the HID and it's not even a competition. The plants will just get severely damaged from heat (as they almost did a few weeks in when one of my ducts sprung a leak and vented hot air into the cab). The LEDs keep chugging.
 
eyecandi

eyecandi

Well-Known Member
I'm done with arguing myself, Sensi and I are on the same page - practical results based on real world measurements that I personally recorded. dispute it and argue away all you want, but I know what's going on in MY space. 'nough said. peace
 
Swiftowl11

Swiftowl11

Active Member
Yeah I found running multiple panels in one area really doesn't affect heat to much. LED heat is handled within its casing and vented out of the led casing, But, when that LED chip heats up the heat is absorbed by the heatsink, which is cooled down by fans that is exhausting the heat out of the LED CASE and into your growing environment, but the process that just took place cooled that radiant heat from the led chips, so the ventilation from led case to cab is cooler and not so intense, so just openings in your cab is suitable for ventilation with lower watt led.
Unlike
HPS, has all that radiant heat around the bulb and unless your using a cooltube, some inlines and ducting, all that radiant heat is in your cab and you need alot more equipment to remove a uncooled bulbs heat from your cab.

My own experience running 4 led panels = 560w, the heat was lower then running my 600w at 300w with running a standard box fan across it. 300w hps would get around 78-79. 4 Panels led would get 72-73. 600w hps same set-up I would get 88-89. 600w with inline under 50%, with ducting and cooltube, kept it at 70. Oh and summer heat in the desert 106 outside , 300w hps is up to 91 degrees inside with just boxfan.
I prefer LED it just means less equipment to use. All i need now is a cheap ass box fan or 2, the good ol days.
 
Harrekin

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
curly604 said:
herrekin!!!! what is up my long lost brotha !!!!! very cool to see you are some what making the switch to leds ..... i remember the early days :D we have een in this thread for some time havent we , please please again it dont matter if we dont get along or dont agree can we please keep it civil here folks? this thread is meant to further the knowledge of leds and led growing that is it ...... read the first 20-40 posts theres enough crap in this thread lets keep it together fellas :D
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Ahh Curly, it's seems I'm still making LED users butt-hurt, although this time unintentionally ;)
 
curly604

curly604

Well-Known Member
hahaha too good man , so you decided to go with blackstar panels eh why did ya choose them if ya dont mind me askin
 
Harrekin

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
curly604 said:
hahaha too good man , so you decided to go with blackstar panels eh why did ya choose them if ya dont mind me askin
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Cost performance ratio Iv observed with them. Any better suggestions? Bear in mind I'm experimenting for extra yield, so I don't wanna spend €1000000000000 on a fancy one either ;)
 
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