Please help me make my crop perfext!

I'm currently growing 15 plants for myself and a few other legal individuals and would like some help identifying some general signs of distress, I have included 17 pictures spread across 3 of the worst afflicted plants but the majority of the plants seem to have a similar affliction.

Keep in mind they are 15 different strains bought as teenagers (1 - 1.5 ft tall) curtently grown under two 250 actual watts LED panels along with two 315w Sun System CMH lights in a 5x9 grow tent with 1 6in air intake and 1 6in exhaust (unfortunately my CMH aren't air-cooled so I'm not sure where to best place my exhaust)

I run the LEDS in blue Veg mode 20 hours a day, and run the dual CMH 16 hours a day due to heat considerations, i like the idea of the two hours of LED "sunrise and sunset" to keep growth moving nicely rather than just the flat 16 hours for both i had in mind before

Temperature went as high as 95 in the first week for 1 or 2 hours at a time in the tent, but has stabilized to 80-88 since installing better ventilation humidity is consistently in the low 40s range

Below i have included my amateur observations


- a white dot like pattern on a few leaves that from a distance resembles fungus but is definitely not WPM (I have been foliar spraying neem oil for about a week and that seemed to definitely push things in a better direction overall but the remaining patches seen in photos are unaffected by the neem oil.

- crispy-ness on the edges of id say 5% of the leaves some plants have none, some have a little, some have 5-10 maybe more crispy leaves. This does not correlate to height or temperature as far as I can tell because it affects lower leaves as much or more than higher up ones. Other observations included the crispy-ness in some cases starts from the stem and goes out on the leaf, but in other cases it goes from the tip of the leaf towards the stem.

- other than that I see more overall droopiness than I would like.

- leaves seem to be growing a bit slowly m9st new growth looks quite good, some have a oranges dead look to the very tips of new growth though very rarely

- major concern for me is PH, I am correcting PH when neccessary when using Nutes, but the RO water id a pretty consistent 6.5, the soil PH as according to the 2 prong soil ph moisture and light reader says its in the mid to high 7 range despite 4 waterings with the PH correct water

I have had them for 2 weeks fed with hose water for first week (potential cause?) And reverse osmosis since then.

I super cropped all of them when I first got them and did have 2 upper stems out of 15 fall off but surrounding growth is moving along quick on those ones, out of the the other 13 most have responded perfectly, with the main stem a bit stunted but the rest of the plant surging and then the mainstream coming back to life with the big knuckle at the break site, id say 3 or 4 of them though have had a very slow recovery and surrounding growth is good but the cropped stem is not developing a knuckle, it is staying alive and slowly growing but lagging behind the ones that are clearly responding well.

I feed them with light doses of calmag, GO Box Nutes ( biogrow, bioweed, biomarine, and diamond black), and have started adding in a ight dose of Armor Si to try and help with the warmer climate(is this worth it ?)

I also had been foliar spraying with neem oil since pick up, and have recently stopped since seeing good results, now i regularly foliar spray with a bit of the Armor Si, Calmag, and Liquid seaweed (advice on foliar spraying is appreciated and sought)

I've also been trying to innocculate them with xtreme gardenings Azos bacteria.

When I up them from 1 gallon to 3 gallon I'm going to try and spread some myko innocculatant all around the root system in addition to Azos. My hope is that the diamond black and molasses I have will help sustain the bacteria.

Also they are currently in the soil the clones came with but I will be replanting them into 3 gallon smart pots with Roots Organics Original soil within a week or so a friend got the same clones and when he replanted it looked like the roots hadn't popped out of the Dixie cup shaped soil it had previously grown in(should i do sooner to benefit from new soil and smart pots?)



If I left anything out just ask in the comments appreciate the help in advance!!

Macromixromacromixro said:

I'm currently growing 15 plants for myself and a few other legal individuals and would like some help identifying some general signs of distress, I have included 17 pictures spread across 3 of the worst afflicted plants but the majority of the plants seem to have a similar affliction.

Keep in mind they are 15 different strains bought as teenagers (1 - 1.5 ft tall) curtently grown under two 250 actual watts LED panels along with two 315w Sun System CMH lights in a 5x9 grow tent with 1 6in air intake and 1 6in exhaust (unfortunately my CMH aren't air-cooled so I'm not sure where to best place my exhaust)

I run the LEDS in blue Veg mode 20 hours a day, and run the dual CMH 16 hours a day due to heat considerations, i like the idea of the two hours of LED "sunrise and sunset" to keep growth moving nicely rather than just the flat 16 hours for both i had in mind before

Temperature went as high as 95 in the first week for 1 or 2 hours at a time in the tent, but has stabilized to 80-88 since installing better ventilation humidity is consistently in the low 40s range

Below i have included my amateur observations


- a white dot like pattern on a few leaves that from a distance resembles fungus but is definitely not WPM (I have been foliar spraying neem oil for about a week and that seemed to definitely push things in a better direction overall but the remaining patches seen in photos are unaffected by the neem oil.

- crispy-ness on the edges of id say 5% of the leaves some plants have none, some have a little, some have 5-10 maybe more crispy leaves. This does not correlate to height or temperature as far as I can tell because it affects lower leaves as much or more than higher up ones. Other observations included the crispy-ness in some cases starts from the stem and goes out on the leaf, but in other cases it goes from the tip of the leaf towards the stem.

- other than that I see more overall droopiness than I would like.

- leaves seem to be growing a bit slowly m9st new growth looks quite good, some have a oranges dead look to the very tips of new growth though very rarely

- major concern for me is PH, I am correcting PH when neccessary when using Nutes, but the RO water id a pretty consistent 6.5, the soil PH as according to the 2 prong soil ph moisture and light reader says its in the mid to high 7 range despite 4 waterings with the PH correct water

I have had them for 2 weeks fed with hose water for first week (potential cause?) And reverse osmosis since then.

I super cropped all of them when I first got them and did have 2 upper stems out of 15 fall off but surrounding growth is moving along quick on those ones, out of the the other 13 most have responded perfectly, with the main stem a bit stunted but the rest of the plant surging and then the mainstream coming back to life with the big knuckle at the break site, id say 3 or 4 of them though have had a very slow recovery and surrounding growth is good but the cropped stem is not developing a knuckle, it is staying alive and slowly growing but lagging behind the ones that are clearly responding well.

I feed them with light doses of calmag, GO Box Nutes ( biogrow, bioweed, biomarine, and diamond black), and have started adding in a ight dose of Armor Si to try and help with the warmer climate(is this worth it ?)

I also had been foliar spraying with neem oil since pick up, and have recently stopped since seeing good results, now i regularly foliar spray with a bit of the Armor Si, Calmag, and Liquid seaweed (advice on foliar spraying is appreciated and sought)

I've also been trying to innocculate them with xtreme gardenings Azos bacteria.

When I up them from 1 gallon to 3 gallon I'm going to try and spread some myko innocculatant all around the root system in addition to Azos. My hope is that the diamond black and molasses I have will help sustain the bacteria.

Also they are currently in the soil the clones came with but I will be replanting them into 3 gallon smart pots with Roots Organics Original soil within a week or so a friend got the same clones and when he replanted it looked like the roots hadn't popped out of the Dixie cup shaped soil it had previously grown in(should i do sooner to benefit from new soil and smart pots?)



If I left anything out just ask in the comments appreciate the help in advance!!

http://imgur.com/a/EMEMsy0

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Post pictures with the grow lights off, please.

temp way too high.
subcool's supersoil recipe, can be found on the web. put plants in it when they are teenagers. until then, grow in just Roots soil only. shouldn't need to add anything. or use large containers with ocean forest soil when they're teenagers. roots until then or maybe light warrior soil. just water. subcool had perfection because he gave up on other fert methods. gave the supersoil recipe a try and it worked. but hard part is the soil must sit alone for 2 months to allow bacteria to break the nutrients down. might need some amending however.
if you want something right now to get started, I suggest dynagro 7-9-5 and follow the instructions on the back. whatever you choose, be careful not to over feed. supersoil puts everything in the soil so there's no need to feed.
this is too late for some of what you have there, but might be useful in the future.

polishpollack said:

temp way too high.
subcool's supersoil recipe, can be found on the web. put plants in it when they are teenagers. until then, grow in just Roots soil only. shouldn't need to add anything. or use large containers with ocean forest soil when they're teenagers. roots until then or maybe light warrior soil. just water. subcool had perfection because he gave up on other fert methods. gave the supersoil recipe a try and it worked. but hard part is the soil must sit alone for 2 months to allow bacteria to break the nutrients down. might need some amending however.
if you want something right now to get started, I suggest dynagro 7-9-5 and follow the instructions on the back. whatever you choose, be careful not to over feed. supersoil puts everything in the soil so there's no need to feed.
this is too late for some of what you have there, but might be useful in the future.

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So it was hot before my ventilation was fixed now it doesn't really go over 87 peak temp.

I've read about supersoil, as an alternative method are you saying its superior to growing with nutrients for veg?

And are you recommending that nutrient as an alternative or in addition to the GO box

Okay so I rarely say anything very negative on here as I hate to discourage people. But those plants need a lot of work before they are gonna do anything of value.

It sounds drastic but any plants that look like the one with the tall top and the other little section of branches at the bottom need to be cut in half. Only keep the bottom set of branches.

Repot asap like tommorow. You can begin to even fix the plants cause you don't know what your working with medium wise.

Scope the hell out of your plants for bugs and if you got russets or broad mites throw them out or go all out chemical warfare but at that point you need to wait so long to flower you might be better off to throw them out.

Buying plants is not good, I don't trust anyone to give me clones and def not plants with medium. I have had major issues caused by taking in clones in the past. You only need a small space to a mother.

Maybe I was being too budget

Apalchen said:

Okay so I rarely say anything very negative on here as I hate to discourage people. But those plants need a lot of work before they are gonna do anything of value.

It sounds drastic but any plants that look like the one with the tall top and the other little section of branches at the bottom need to be cut in half. Only keep the bottom set of branches.

Repot asap like tommorow. You can begin to even fix the plants cause you don't know what your working with medium wise.

Scope the hell out of your plants for bugs and if you got russets or broad mites throw them out or go all out chemical warfare but at that point you need to wait so long to flower you might be better off to throw them out.

Buying plants is not good, I don't trust anyone to give me clones and def not plants with medium. I have had major issues caused by taking in clones in the past. You only need a small space to a mother.

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Maybe I was being too budget conscious but could not find a reliable and affordable looking vendor, throw me some recommendations

No pest issues as far as i can tell, but the plants have atleast tripled in size in less than 2 weeks grown much bushier under the indoor lighting.

It seems your saying I need a more even canopy, I super cropped to get everything low to start with and will install scrog net tommorow upon repotting, is it really neccessary to remove the plant material when it can be flattened via LST, Scrog, and super cropping?

Macromixromacromixro said:

Maybe I was being too budget



Maybe I was being too budget conscious but could not find a reliable and affordable looking vendor, throw me some recommendations

No pest issues as far as i can tell, but the plants have atleast tripled in size in less than 2 weeks grown much bushier under the indoor lighting.

It seems your saying I need a more even canopy, I super cropped to get everything low to start with and will install scrog net tommorow upon repotting, is it really neccessary to remove the plant material when it can be flattened via LST, Scrog, and super cropping?

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It's not necessary if your doing a scrog net. I find plants respond well to be chopped on though.

I don't have any good recs for nursery as they all scare the hell out of me, I keep mothers and hunt seeds when I need new ones, it is a bit more work but I never have to worry about contamination from outside sources which is where the bad stuff like russets, broad mites and hops latent viroid are most likely to come from.

If your in Cali maybe dark heart nursery, or the one Kevin jodrey owns I think it's called wonderland. But I've never used them as I don't live there. The clone guys here in mi as far as I can tell pass around bugs and virus with no care to what happens after the sale. I'm sure their are a few good ones but after battling Russets just once I think I'll stick to running from my mothers I select from seed.

"I've read about supersoil, as an alternative method are you saying its superior to growing with nutrients for veg?"

Only superior due to the fact that supersoil takes much of the guesswork out. Typically when people give nutrients, they don't really know what they're doing which is why they tend to come here looking for help. It's after-the-fact and too late, but better late than never and at least they might learn something, or learn what not to do next time. If you look at Subcool's videos on youtube, he doesn't always show plants but when he does they look great for an indoor grow. He had problems with bugs and you might have the same. He thought his battle with russet mites was due to bringing in a clone from outside when he usually grew from seed. This caused him all kinds of problems as they are very small and hide well and can tolerate drought. Supersoil is good for the entire grow cycle. You have to use enough of it to last that long so a large container is in order. It makes feeding plants easier as you don't usually have to add anything to it if it's made right. It has to be mixed and sit for a couple months before it's ready to use. Bacteria break down the molecules to a small size that plants can absorb. Or you can just buy Foxfarm ocean forest or happy frog soil - ready to use now.

"And are you recommending that nutrient as an alternative or in addition to the GO box"

Alternative, but mixing it in large amounts is a pain.

Apalchen said:

It's not necessary if your doing a scrog net. I find plants respond well to be chopped on though.

I don't have any good recs for nursery as they all scare the hell out of me, I keep mothers and hunt seeds when I need new ones, it is a bit more work but I never have to worry about contamination from outside sources which is where the bad stuff like russets, broad mites and hops latent viroid are most likely to come from.

If your in Cali maybe dark heart nursery, or the one Kevin jodrey owns I think it's called wonderland. But I've never used them as I don't live there. The clone guys here in mi as far as I can tell pass around bugs and virus with no care to what happens after the sale. I'm sure their are a few good ones but after battling Russets just once I think I'll stick to running from my mothers I select from seed.

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What about seeds?

I'm open to growing seeds for my next batch 8n a veg tent or just a couple of them to mix up the genetics I want to grow 5 or 6 strains at a time

Start seeds in seed starting soil. Super soils are placed in the bottom half or two thirds of the container. I suppose you could try starting in Roots soil if you want. Black Gold perhaps or similar soil at a store, but don't use miracle grow or FFOF. Light warrior might be good for seeds but never used it so don't know for sure. Use something that isn't loaded with nutrients if you're starting seeds.

polishpollack said:

Start seeds in seed starting soil. Super soils are placed in the bottom half or two thirds of the container. I suppose you could try starting in Roots soil if you want. Black Gold perhaps or similar soil at a store, but don't use miracle grow or FFOF. Light warrior might be good for seeds but never used it so don't know for sure. Use something that isn't loaded with nutrients if you're starting seeds.

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Where would be a good place to get seeds?

google search.

polishpollack said:

google search.

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Sorry for valuing this community's opinions?

Macromixromacromixro said:

Where would be a good place to get seeds?

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Where are you from?

.

Click, then go to shop, then scroll down to Vashon seeds. or pick whatever sounds good to you.