So much bad advice, who can give rep

"here are the dv for a 2k cal diet:
http://www.netrition.com/rdi_page.html
for converting nutrition facts/daily values

also, the wholesome sweeteners' tablespoon is 22 g, not the 15-16 g of some conversion charts for tablespoon-to-ml.

apparent standards
1 mg =1 ppm, when water is solvent

1 g = 1 cc = 1 ml

%dv (daily values) are based on 2k reference values for nutritional labeling (non-plant food product)

not all tablespoons measured the same... check mg/g for specific tbsp weight.

the #'s...:

wholesome sweeteners organic molasses
per 1 tablespoon/22 g, in 1 gallon of water/3.785 liters:

potassium: 730 mg/~20% of 3500 mg dv for k/730/3.785=192.86 ppm

calcium: 115 mg/~10% of 1000 mg dv for ca/115/3.785=30.38 ppm

magnesium: 8% of 400 mg dv for mg/.08*400=32/3.785=8.4 ppm

iron: 15% of 18 mg dv for fe/.15*18=2.7/3.785=0.71 ppm

vitamin b6: 10% of 2.0 mg dv for vit b6/2*.1=.2/3.785=.05 ppm

sugars: 10g

total carbohydrates: 14g


hope this helps." miztrez

"standards
1 tablespoon=14.78 ml (~15 ml)
1 ounce=29.57 ml (~30 ml)

to obtain the ppm of any nutrient in your plant food mix when the ounces of fertilizer per 100 gal of water and the fertilizer percentages are known, calculate:

nutrient in solution, ppm=.75*nutrient%*dilution rate, ounces/100 gallons

example:
gh flora nova bloom npk%: 4-8-7
@ .5 ounces/1 tbspn/15 ml per 1 gallon of water

nitrogen 4% [.75*4*50]= 150 ppm

phosphate 8% [.75*8*50]= 300 ppm

potash 7% [.75*7*50]= 262.5 ppm

calcium 4% [.75*4*50]= 150 ppm

magnesium 2% [.75*2*50]= 75 ppm

sulfur 2% [.75*2*50]= 75 ppm

chelated iron .1% [.75*.1*50]= 3.75 ppm

these should be the ppm#'s per 1 tablespoon of gh fnb, per gallon of water. please confirm using spreadsheets/other methods.

the above formula is easily scalable + convertable/reversible. just algebra...

hope this helps. enjoy your garden!"

best of the growing edge, 2
greenhouse math, by samuel p. faulkner, phd:

what if you know how mucgh fertilizer you dissolved per 100 gal in a batch tank?... the problem is that you dont know the concentration of nutrients in the tank.

to obtain the ppm of any nutrient in your plant food mix when the ounces of fertilizer percentages are known, calculate:

nutrient in solution, ppm=0.75*%nutrient*dilution rate, ounces/gal

example given:
lets say you used a rate of 15 oz of a 20-20-20 water plant food for a 100-gal batch of fertilizer solution.

what are the concentrations of nitrogen, phosphorus, or potash in the batch?

it will be the same for all nutrients because they are all 20% by weight in the dry fertilizer.

the calculation is:
nutrient in solution, ppm=0.75*20*15oz/100gal=225 ppm each of n, p2o5, k20.

thus, substituting the #'s for flora nova bloom, @ 15 ml per gal, or 50 ounces per 100 gallons, using just the n, we have,

0.75*4*50 (since we are applying ~1/2 ounce per gallon, and a 1/2 ounce is ~1 tablespoon, for 100 gallons, we will have a total of 50 ounces).

formula a:

.75*4*50=150 ppm of n per gallon.

discovered another mathematical formula. lets see if it comes to similar #'s...

http://www.growfaq.net/index.php?sid...513&artlang=en

the formula for the ^ link is:
> one tablespoon (15ml) of fertilizer in a gallon of water:

(10xN)÷ 0.256 = ppm

therefore, we can insert the gh flora nova bloom, finding for only the n, we have,

formula b:
**(10*4)/.256=156.25 ppm of n per gallon.

this may also be helpful:
http://www.umass.edu/umext/floricult.../fertcalc.html

the weights of the ferts are included in the calculations. the spreadsheet may be a little off. these formulas are from greenhouse engineering standards.

in both calculations ^, the n from ~15 ml/1 tbsp of fnb, is ~150 ppm. how did you get all the way to 200+?

hope this helps. enjoy your garden!

think it will be figured out though...

Check this molasses, with NPK listed. Are we done here? I teach tomorrow... guess we will be talking about the glory of food grade certified organic fair trade molasses.
http://www.beorganic.com/products/images/PDFs/blackmolasses.pdf

Matt Rize said:

The complex plant extracts don't show on ppm meter bro. Does powder guano show on your ppm meter? how about rock phos? Are you really trying to analyze molasses with a ppm meter like bottled nutes?

Click to expand...

Actually bro, I have several organic products around my house that contribute hundreds of ppms to a gallon of water but I agree that it doesn't mean there aren't more minerals available after the microbes convert them into inorganic materials that the plants can use.

Regardless of the end nutrient availability, you cannot side step the fact that the mineral analysis of molasses is weak (http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/sweets/5573/2). Even your high horse organic brand is so weak and expensive that I'd put it in the category of snake oils.

homebrewer said:

Actually bro, I have several organic products around my house that contribute hundreds of ppms to a gallon of water but I agree that it doesn't mean there aren't more minerals available after the microbes convert them into inorganic materials that the plants can use.

Regardless of the end nutrient availability, you cannot side step the fact that the mineral analysis of molasses is weak (http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/sweets/5573/2). Even your high horse organic brand is so weak and expensive that I'd put it in the category of snake oils.

Click to expand...

maybe you should look up the definition of snake oil...

organic products that raise the ppm hundreds are probably not that organic after all... if the nutes are already processed, that defeats the purpose of microbial nutrient processing, the basis of real organics. the word organic, as used by omri, doesn't mean much. USDA organic is an actual certification. OMRI is a listing service that you pay to use their image on your label, a scheme that charges a % of sales.

0-.5-3 ... not so weak and higher quality than anything from the grow store. those 3 numbers don't even include the calmag or sugars. Both earth juice and botanicare sell molasses now...

Also... I backed up my info, even tho you were skeptical. What are you doing other than talking trash and promoting bottled nutes from grow stores? Aloe vera juice and molasses are as good as it gets in terms of quality products to feed your plants.

Matt Rize said:

0-.5-3 ... not so weak and higher quality than anything from the grow store. those 3 numbers don't even include the calmag or sugars. Both earth juice and botanicare sell molasses now...

Click to expand...

Higher quality? Is that a joke? You will not grow healthy plants with molasses alone and even as a supplement, an intelligent gardener would opt for more something more practical, useful and economical.

homebrewer said:

Higher quality? Is that a joke? You will not grow healthy plants with molasses alone and even as a supplement, an intelligent gardener would opt for more something more practical, useful and economical.

Click to expand...

your words are empty, no meaning or substance. just shit talking with no point or value. Yes, certified organic and certified fair trade human grade molasses is higher quality than plant food listed by OMRI. Useful... apparently you don't brew compost tea either. Hope you followed that link and learned something about Daily Value to ppm conversions.

Matt Rize said:

your words are empty, no meaning or substance. Yes, certified organic and certified fair trade human grade molasses is higher quality than plant food listed by OMRI. Useful... apparently you don't brew compost tea either.

Click to expand...

What about Grandma's molasses?

Bwpz said:

What about Grandma's molasses?

Click to expand...

not certified organic or fair trade, still useful for its sugar, potassium, and calmag. Bulk blackstrap molasses is about $20/gallon for the higher grades... cheaper than any grow store nute.

Matt Rize said:

your words are empty, no meaning or substance. just shit talking with no point or value. Yes, certified organic and certified fair trade human grade molasses is higher quality than plant food listed by OMRI. Useful... apparently you don't brew compost tea either. Hope you followed that link and learned something about Daily Value to ppm conversions.

Click to expand...

Ok kid. You love your organic high horse and obviously are incapable admitting when you're wasting your money.

Once again, i'll post the mineral content of molasses as it would appear on a fertilzer bottle (http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/sweets/5573/2).

• Calcium ----- .205%
  
• Iron ---------- .0047%
• Magnesium --- .242%
  
• Phosphorus -- .031%
  
• Potassium --- 1.464%
  
• Sodium ------ .037%
  
• Zinc -------- .0003%
  
• Copper ------ .0005%
  
• Manganese --- .0015%
  
• Selenium ---- .0178%

homebrewer said:

Ok kid. You love your organic high horse and obviously are incapable admitting when you're wasting your money.

Once again, i'll post the mineral content of molasses as it would appear on a fertilzer bottle (http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/sweets/5573/2).

Click to expand...

kid, real nice, lol, just because I handed you your ass... you don't have to call names, whatevers dude. %DV to ppm is over your head obviously. this is high school math...

Bro, I converted molasses to ppm for you, maybe I lost you with the math. You are listing %DV for 2000cal diet, and we are talking nutrition in molasses as it joins the soil food web and is converted to a form usable by plants. Do you get it yet? Those numbers you posted are not what you think...

Matt Rize said:

kid, real nice, lol, just because I handed you your ass... you don't have to call names, whatevers dude.

Bro, I converted molasses to ppm for you, maybe I lost you with the math. You are listing %DV for 2000cal diet, and we are talking nutrition in molasses as it joins the soil food web and is converted to a form usable by plants. Do you get it yet?

Click to expand...

The number I posted above are based on percentages by weight which is how fertilizers work. The link is there, check my math. Do you get it yet that you're being ripped off?

i dont see those #s, where did they come from? $20/gallon rip off? I think you need to redo that math as well.

i see this. mg per cup. and %DV for eating a cup of molasses. did you follow my math? my numbers don't lie, i showed my math. 0-.5-3 IS REAL, and close to many organic bottled nutes.

Amounts Per Selected Serving%DV
Calcium691mg69%
Iron15.9mg88%
Magnesium816mg204%
Phosphorus104mg10%
Potassium4933mg141%
Sodium125mg5%
Zinc1.0mg7%
Copper1.6mg82%
Manganese5.2mg258%
Selenium60.0mcg86%
Fluoride

I see high amounts of Cal/Mag and other trace nutrients. How could that be bad again?

Bwpz said:

I see high amounts of Cal/Mag and other trace nutrients. How could that be bad again?

Click to expand...

It's great. HB is just confused by some algebra. Not only does molasses neutralize chlorine and chloramines, it feeds soil life, feeds the plants, and is cheap compared to bottled nutes. I think his girlfriend cheated on him with a molasses sales rep. Or just look at the bottle industry, and the heavy use of molasses by nute companies in their formulas.

alright, im done arguing w HB, its too easy. I posted my numbers and math. The ppms I listed are correct, there is no question. HB is confused (posting % in red, too cute really, we are talking ppm for one and for two those numbers are not on that link), and its all good. We may even be posting the same data but I actually calculated ppm. and with that: goodnite

Matt Rize said:

i dont see those #s, where did they come from? $20/gallon rip off? I think you need to redo that math as well.

i see this. mg per cup. and %DV for eating a cup of molasses. did you follow my math? my numbers don't lie, i showed my math. 0-.5-3 IS REAL, and close to many organic bottled nutes.

Amounts Per Selected Serving%DV
Calcium691mg69%
Iron15.9mg88%
Magnesium816mg204%
Phosphorus104mg10%
Potassium4933mg141%
Sodium125mg5%
Zinc1.0mg7%
Copper1.6mg82%
Manganese5.2mg258%
Selenium60.0mcg86%
Fluoride

Click to expand...

You keep quoting 'math' but you're doing it incorrectly and you're looking at the wrong measurement. One tablespoon weighs 20,000mgs. Take the 41mg calcium value as a percentage of total weight and you get a pathetic .2%. The percentage by weight doesn't change based on dosage. Is it really that hard for you to understand? Is my math too inorganic for you?

I'll explain the calculation in the morning. 3.785 is the key and has a lot of research behind it. I didn't make this up.

potassium: 730 mg/~20% of 3500 mg dv for k/730/3.785=192.86 ppm

Click to expand...

Matt Rize said:

I'll explain the calculation in the morning. 3.785 is the key and has a lot of research behind it. I didn't make this up.

Click to expand...

Look, I understand how you're arriving at the ppm values, the same conversions using grandma's Nutrition facts totals less than my measured ppm so there are obviously things contributing to the TDS that aren't listed. What I'm trying to do is compare apples to apples in regards to guaranteed analysis labeling which you're either ignoring or not understanding. The brand you keep referencing is weakly concentrated compared to real plant foods and at $40 a quart a Tbs dosage, it's very expensive. As compared to other molasses brands, it may be more desirable from a mineral content perspective but that still doesn't mean you're able to grow healthy plants with it, nor does it make it an economical plant food based on the alternatives. That is my point about molasses in general.

matt rize said:

kid, real nice, lol, just because i handed you your ass... You don't have to call names, whatevers dude. %dv to ppm is over your head obviously. This is high school math...

Bro, i converted molasses to ppm for you, maybe i lost you with the math. You are listing %dv for 2000cal diet, and we are talking nutrition in molasses as it joins the soil food web and is converted to a form usable by plants. Do you get it yet? Those numbers you posted are not what you think...

Click to expand...

homebrewer said:

Ok kid. You love your organic high horse and obviously are incapable admitting when you're wasting your money.

Once again, i'll post the mineral content of molasses as it would appear on a fertilzer bottle (http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/sweets/5573/2).

• calcium ----- .205%
  
• iron ---------- .0047%
• magnesium --- .242%
  
• phosphorus -- .031%
  
• potassium --- 1.464%
  
• sodium ------ .037%
  
• zinc -------- .0003%
  
• copper ------ .0005%
  
• manganese --- .0015%
  
• selenium ---- .0178%

Click to expand...

classic fail, I UNDER LINED WHERE YOU GOT TURNED FROM NATE TO NANCY