UV Suppliment Lighting

DrGreenT420

Active Member
has anyone here tried using just the UVA diodes?
I was considering it but its definitely looking like there are better options for right now. If youre really interested though, RapidLED has a pretty good deal on their solderless UVA (390-400nm) diode at $5.50. Dont know how well they really work though or how long they last.
 
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Randomblame

Well-Known Member
I'd rather have the other ones and run them 8 HRS at 12"s plus the arcadias are cheaper, I think

Yeah, Mo, reptile bulbs do a much better job and they do not damage the plants. These Arcadia's are much too strong and their UVB to UVA ratio is also wrong and indeed harmful. Solacure's are also very strong but at least they have a siutable UVA/B ratio and try to mimic the sun light. Since I know that an opposite UVA/B ratio destroys plant cells and tissue I'm really pissed off.
I've wasted more than 200 bucks to get 6 of 2footers, wasted another 100 for ballasts, dimmable ballast aso. just to found out that these bulbs are completely wrong for plant growing. Believe me, currently I would like to punch this Agromax idiots in the face.. all day long! 300 wasted and 25% lost with the latest harvest!
Take 12 or 14% Arcadia bulbs, bro! 12% bulbs are good for 8-12" and 14% is enough for 12-16" distance.


Does anyone know how much UV is too much UV? How do i even calculate that?

You can calculated the daily amount of UVB by multiplying the μW/cm² measurments (or calculated intensity) by 0,036.
Lets say you have a 12% bulb 12" away from the tops. According to the bulb test below you should have center readings of around 150μW/cm² with a hammered alli reflector.
Screenshot_20190404-082922.png

In 3h you would have 450μW and multiplied with 0,036 you would have a center dose of 16,2kJ/m². With 150μW center intensity the average is probably only a third if we use a 2ft bulb to cover 4ft² (a 2x 2' area). So the average dose is probably more like 5,4kJ/m².
The calculation is a bit difficult and instead to use a long formula I've simply calculated a conversion factor.

Easiest formula if you interested..
If 1w is = 1Joule, then 1μW/cm²/s is equal to 0,000001kJ/cm²/s.
Multiplied by 3600sec(1h) = 0,0036kJ/cm²/h.
This times 10 to come on m² means we get to 0,036kJ/m²/h if we work with 1μW/cm².

Other formulas also exsist but you end up with the same results so the calculation must be right( thanks to my unbeatable vulcan logic, lol).

This .pdf below is a UVB bulb test (bare bulb and with 3 different types of reflectors) of an for 100h burned in 12% Arcadia bulb and with it's help you can get an idea of the actual peak intensity in your tent even without UVB meter. The average intensity is ~⅓ of the peak intensity if you use a 2ft bulb each 4ft² (or a 3ft bulb for a 6ft² or 8ft² per 4 ft bulb).

You can even use it for the 14% bulbs when you calculate with 4"/10cm more distance cause the 14% bulbs reach around 4" deeper. When you get ~150μW with 12" out of a 12% bulb you get almost the same 150μW with a 14% bulb and 16" distance.

Only make sure to take an uncoated metallic reflector. Glas, plastics aso. swallows UV light!
 

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DrGreenT420

Active Member
Your amount of knowledge is truly incredible. Did some looking around for those Arcadia fixtures and they're non existent in the US. At least Im able to pick up the bulbs. Since all those tests were done with the 2ft 12% bulbs. Would me deciding to get the 3ft bulbs affect those results any or should I still be able to expect the same μW/cm² reading at that given height ? Looking at the SunBlaster NanoTech hood atm. Seems decently cheap and it was tested in that study very closely to the hammered aluminium, slightly higher μW/cm² readings (157 μW/cm² vs 148 μW/cm²) at the same height, but not too much more to cause harm I dont think. Too bad they didnt test the Arcadia bulbs in the Reptisun hood, I would've been interested to see that, I like the wider coverage on the Reptisun fixture. If I had to guess, the Reptisun fixture with Arcadia bulb would read slightly less than the 148μW/cm² from the Arcadia hood at the same height (30cm) due the the wider spread ?
 
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Randomblame

Well-Known Member
You could even DIY such a fixture. Simply order a cheap hammered stucco reflector cut a 6inch wide piece off and bend it like a wing reflector. Order a few T5 bulb sockets from e3ay(a 5 pack costs 1,50$), you need two for each bulb and at last order a T5HO ballast and some single core AWG20 wire. (Important: the wires can not be longer like 2m)
Usually the 24w ones can be used for 2ft/24w "and" 3ft/39w bulbs.
For my 1st build I've just used a 24x 6" alli sheet and bend it like this \_/.
Only make sure there is no fancy glas coating like on adjust-a-wing reflectors or other hoods.
The cheapest ones are the ones doing the best job with UV.
I don't think there is a big difference between the available fixtures when you measure the average intensity. The peak intensity says only how much you get in the center and with a 90° reflector you get higher readings like with a 120° reflector but the total amount UVB distributed is almost the same. I rather have better distribution and less hot spot...


I've found my new dimmable 2 bulb ballast for 18$ on am4zon(a Philips HFregulator 224-TLS 220-240) but I don't believe its available in the US. But with reptile bulbs there is no need for dimming. I've ordered it only cuz I wanne try to use the Agromax bulbs dimmed down before I finally sell them (at least the 4 unused ones). Maybe I can figure out a way to use them without yield loss and burnings and if not.. These bulbs are not available in the EU so when I offer them for 25 a piece on e3ay I should get at least a part of my investment back.

If you can get the 14% bulbs - get them!
If you can get only 10 or 12% bulbs you can also use the Hortilux powerveg+ bulbs they have almost the same spectrum.
I expecially like the Arcadias because they have a CRI90 or 95 spectrum, 7 or 8k. This means they also add some nice blue light to the spectrum. An if you look at the spectrum the spikes fits perfect to widen the blue range below and above 450nm.

I plan to use UV light only in the 1st half of the day and use some far-red with the 2nd half of the day. But before I can test it I have to figure out if there is a way to use these Agromax bad boys. I have my Arcadia's already waiting and can use them at least in my smaller 3sft area.
Believe me, you will be impressed when you see the difference. These light also brings a lot more colors to life and also the terpene content will increase which means it also smells stronger in your garden. So keep that in mind...
 

Moflow

Well-Known Member
You could even DIY such a fixture. Simply order a cheap hammered stucco reflector cut a 6inch wide piece off and bend it like a wing reflector. Order a few T5 bulb sockets from e3ay(a 5 pack costs 1,50$), you need two for each bulb and at last order a T5HO ballast and some single core AWG20 wire. (Important: the wires can not be longer like 2m)
Usually the 24w ones can be used for 2ft/24w "and" 3ft/39w bulbs.
For my 1st build I've just used a 24x 6" alli sheet and bend it like this \_/.
Only make sure there is no fancy glas coating like on adjust-a-wing reflectors or other hoods.
The cheapest ones are the ones doing the best job with UV.
I don't think there is a big difference between the available fixtures when you measure the average intensity. The peak intensity says only how much you get in the center and with a 90° reflector you get higher readings like with a 120° reflector but the total amount UVB distributed is almost the same. I rather have better distribution and less hot spot...


I've found my new dimmable 2 bulb ballast for 18$ on am4zon(a Philips HFregulator 224-TLS 220-240) but I don't believe its available in the US. But with reptile bulbs there is no need for dimming. I've ordered it only cuz I wanne try to use the Agromax bulbs dimmed down before I finally sell them (at least the 4 unused ones). Maybe I can figure out a way to use them without yield loss and burnings and if not.. These bulbs are not available in the EU so when I offer them for 25 a piece on e3ay I should get at least a part of my investment back.

If you can get the 14% bulbs - get them!
If you can get only 10 or 12% bulbs you can also use the Hortilux powerveg+ bulbs they have almost the same spectrum.
I expecially like the Arcadias because they have a CRI90 or 95 spectrum, 7 or 8k. This means they also add some nice blue light to the spectrum. An if you look at the spectrum the spikes fits perfect to widen the blue range below and above 450nm.

I plan to use UV light only in the 1st half of the day and use some far-red with the 2nd half of the day. But before I can test it I have to figure out if there is a way to use these Agromax bad boys. I have my Arcadia's already waiting and can use them at least in my smaller 3sft area.
Believe me, you will be impressed when you see the difference. These light also brings a lot more colors to life and also the terpene content will increase which means it also smells stronger in your garden. So keep that in mind...
A quick question, do yoù need, use eye protection, cover your skin when using these arcadia tubes?. For instance, If you have a lizard vivarium do you need to turn the tube off before going close to the tank
And slightly off topic, what about the CMH lamps, do they give off dangerous amounts of uv?
I've gotta be careful of uv, going to hospital to get biopsy on a few moles next week....
Already been 3 times over the years....:o
 

Frank Cannon

Well-Known Member
Whilst I do look somewhat similar, I'm not quite as old as you cuz BUT close! Frank Cannon was our slang in the ole days in New Zealand for a big greasy number- "should we go get Franked" brings back memories...bongsmilie

Careful with the skin cancer mate, I have had it and we need to keep it in check and be checked! 5% chance of dying from it once diagnosed.
 

eyderbuddy

Well-Known Member
@Randomblame thanks for the knowledge man. maybe we could figure out a ratio of how many "watts" of Arcadias or Purevegs per watt of actual grow light LED

Btw i took a look at your lights, and i'm using a very similar setup but without the UV (YET)

Did you ever do a Side by side UV/No UV testing? What's your opinion on your growlights? ( with and without UV)
 

Keesje

Well-Known Member

GreeneryBob

Well-Known Member
I will rephrase, has anyone here 'personally' tried using UVA diodes and noticed any positive change? (I know UV diodes aren't as wonderful as UVB bulbs but I'm not too keen on destroying my gorilla tent with UVB) I am thinking about ordering some from cutter to hopefully boost terpenes and make it less comfortable for any bugs. More interested in various blues and 405nm to be honest but they have some UVA boards too.
 
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Moflow

Well-Known Member
I just started reading about UV-A and UV-B.
Total noob.

Can those lamps also be used in Europe with 220/240?
I see that they ship to Europe, but no clue if you just can use them.

Or is there a similair product that is for sale in the EU?
Yes, they can be used on 220/240v
 

Keesje

Well-Known Member
Thanks.
So it would be possible to only buy the lamps and get the fixtures somewhere else?
They ask a lot of money for their fixtures. Maybe they are special...
 

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
I just started reading about UV-A and UV-B.
Total noob.

Can those lamps also be used in Europe with 220/240?
I see that they ship to Europe, but no clue if you just can use them.

Or is there a similair product that is for sale in the EU?

When you can get them incl. a siutable T12 fixture there is nothing wrong with them. They are much stronger like reptile bulbs so 1-3h per day should be enough but they are for sure more expensive and each time you replace them you have to pay additional shipping costs and custom fees. And shipping such bulbs is expensive because of the huge packages.

For EU peeps I recommend to get the Arcadia reptile bulb called D3desert(12%) or D3dragon(14%). They are strong enough to get the same results, you can use them for up to 12h as soon as the plants are used to it and they do not damage the plants no matter how long they are running. Plants need only a week to get used to UVB which means the 1st week only 1-3h but then there is no limit.
The Solacure bulbs are so strong they can damage the plants and they need a certain minimum distance of 20-24".
Reptile bulbs can be used with less distance. 8-12" with the 12% bulbs and 12-16" with the 14% bulbs. To cover 2x 2c area evenly you need at least 12" distance and a metallic reflector.


(I know UV diodes aren't as wonderful as UVB bulbs but I'm not too keen on destroying my gorilla tent with UVB) I will rephrase, has anyone here 'personally' tried using UVA diodes and noticed any positive change? (I know UV diodes aren't as wonderful as UVB bulbs but I'm not too keen on destroying my gorilla tent with UVB) I am thinking about ordering some from cutter to hopefully boost terpenes and make it less comfortable for any bugs. More interested in various blues and 405nm to be honest but they have some UVA boards too.

Why do you believe UVB light destroys your gorilla tent? I've seen many peeps using UVB and till now no one mentioned such things. Has it white coated tent walls? In this case its possible that you see a purplish tint with the time but with mylar on the walls there is no such coloration.


@Randomblame thanks for the knowledge man. maybe we could figure out a ratio of how many "watts" of Arcadias or Purevegs per watt of actual grow light LED

Btw i took a look at your lights, and i'm using a very similar setup but without the UV (YET)

Did you ever do a Side by side UV/No UV testing? What's your opinion on your growlights? ( with and without UV)

I've 325w white, 10w far-red and I add 20w hyperred this month so 355w LED and I have two 2ft bulbs now which means ~48w UVA/B. Works for me and means a 7:1 ratio. But only 12% is UVB and 30% of the 48w are UVA. The rest is visible light and should be added to the amount of LED light. Too complicated for my taste and even then its probably more UVB like the natural 1-3% of the sun light. But god thanks thats not an issue with reptile bulbs. I've used them 12" above the tops for 12" and you get ~150μW/cm² in the center out of a 12% bulb. So 150x 12h= 1800μW/cm² x 0,036= a wooping dose of 64,8kJ/m² directly under the bulbs. Calculated with 40% to come near to average numbers thats still 26kJ/m².

And yes, I've done w/ and w/o tests and have seen several differences.
I've used a well known GreenPoison clone for this tests and have grown the strain for around a year before I've startet to use UVB light. So it was pretty easy to spot differences because I knew what she could do.
The first differences you'll see is the plants grow a little more compact and stay shorter. Maybe because of the extra blue but this is also an effect of UVB. When plants receive UVB the UVR8 molecules gets destroyed and the plants recognize, "OMG, there is UVB! I need to protect myself and my possible babies as fast as I can".
Branches will faster get strong and woody, leaves stay a little smaller too, they also look darker because of more densely packed chlorophyll inside the leaves. The transition goes faster too and I've seen the first preflowers on the UVB side within 3 fecken days, you get less stretch and shorter internodial spacings too and last but not least the plants start earlier to from the 1st trichomes. Up to a week earlier! They do everything a little faster and and later in flower you'll see much more purple, red and other colors. I also believe it has a shortening effect on the flowering cycle but I've also used far-red so I can not say that for sure.
Positive side effect, insects and fungal infects are also no problem anymore. Insects can see UV light and they avoid it because it damages their dna and UVB kills spores pretty fast too. Not as fast as UVC does, this takes only seconds, but UVB is used for hours so you can be sure it will do the same.

I've also tested it with a usually slightly purple Bubba's Gift I've used a few times before under my 160w LED and with 24w UVB (12% Arcadia bulb) this strain ended up looking almost like a black widow. The upper half of the buds were almost black and the colors also dissapeared pretty slow with the curing. The buds are still visible darker.
Also the upper leaves ended up getting almost black and when two leaves have overlapped the lower leaf still stays green. So it was for sure an effect of the UV light.
 

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
Thanks.
So it would be possible to only buy the lamps and get the fixtures somewhere else?
They ask a lot of money for their fixtures. Maybe they are special...

Pretty hard to find outdated T12 fixtures and ballast. That's maybe the reason why they have used this standard and not T5.
They can sell their fixtures and can almost dictate a price because there is no competitor using the same standard.
One could say, pretty smart these guys, lol!
But that's too smart for my taste and when I see such things I usually get a tourette impulse and want to hit such peeps in the face. You can use the same coatings in all types of bulbs and you would still get almost the same spectrum. Coolwhite stays also coolwhite no matter if its T5, T8 or T12. The whole thing with the old T12 standard is a shitty marketing trick to create more profit.

Reptile bulbs are much cheaper and you can build a 2ft 24w DIY T5 fixture incl. bulb and ballast for ~50 bucks.
 

ChiefRunningPhist

Well-Known Member
has anyone here tried using just the UVA diodes?
I will rephrase, has anyone here 'personally' tried using UVA diodes and noticed any positive change? (I know UV diodes aren't as wonderful as UVB bulbs but I'm not too keen on destroying my gorilla tent with UVB) I am thinking about ordering some from cutter to hopefully boost terpenes and make it less comfortable for any bugs. More interested in various blues and 405nm to be honest but they have some UVA boards too.
I'll be using. Have not yet though. I'm convinced that LED can be just as viable as fluoro (if not more) when it comes to UV. Here's some key WV's documented with respect to UV (loosely)...
Screenshot_2019-03-23-10-52-38~3.png
I'm working on adding 12w of UV diodes on dimmable channels to a 150w white light. 2:1 ratio of UVA:UVB. UVB its own channel. :bigjoint: (Check sig for progress)
 
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