• Here is a link to the full explanation: https://rollitup.org/t/welcome-back-did-you-try-turning-it-off-and-on-again.1104810/

What is Your Opinion of the Pledge of Allegiance?

lopezri

lopezri

Well-Known Member
AAAaaaarrrggggh. I really wish some of you people would read the initial posts before just throwing out any ole' argument just to stir the pot (so to speak). My first two posts in this thread sum up the whole thing with the Pledge of Allegiance but apparently there are just too many of you that can't read with any comprehension. The Pledge of Allegiance IS a pledge from each individual person reciting it, to each legal citizen of the United States. It IS NOT a pledge to the Republic. They just use the word republic to mean the all inclusive states that make up the whole country. When we recite the pledge we are bascially telling all the other citizens that we live along side with and within the same country that we pledge to try to uphold the same values for them that we uphold for ourselves. The pledge was designed to tell each other that we would be willing to sacrifice ourselves for our fellow neighbors to help protect them, if they also would sacrifice themselves to save YOU! The pledge has nothing to do with an icon, it simple states within the pledge how to honor each other and how to show your honor for your fellow citizens by performing the particular ritual that is performed during the Pledge of Allegiance.

And to any of you that try to use the whole argument regarding the U.S. having more imprisoned people than any other recognized state, remember the reason why that is the case is because we value life more than other countires. We would rather use imprisonment as punishment as opposed to just beheading you or electrocution, etc. Hmmmm, does Iran put up with people breaking their laws just by putting them in a candy ass prison? No, it's a very torturous ordeal over there.
 
lopezri

lopezri

Well-Known Member
Wordz said:
Where was the race card in that? Does that stuff happen or not? Dude you're tryin to pull in shit that's not on subject. Of course you had to make an attack at me because you can't deny it. Once the personal attacks come in I've won you've lost. I'm legally entitled to sit through the pledge or anthem whenever I want.
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So you're just going to continue to make the U.S. into the country you dislike so much by refusing to try to practice the traditions that once made it a great nation? The only way YOU can make a difference in this situation is to be the honorable one and recite the Pledge of Allegiance proudly, with the honor that it once used to have. You're headed down the wrong fork in the road, bud. The BEST way to make POSITIVE CHANGE is to LEAD BY GOOD EXAMPLE!!
 
Rob Roy

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
lopezri said:
AAAaaaarrrggggh. I really wish some of you people would read the initial posts before just throwing out any ole' argument just to stir the pot (so to speak). My first two posts in this thread sum up the whole thing with the Pledge of Allegiance but apparently there are just too many of you that can't read with any comprehension. The Pledge of Allegiance IS a pledge from each individual person reciting it, to each legal citizen of the United States. It IS NOT a pledge to the Republic. They just use the word republic to mean the all inclusive states that make up the whole country. When we recite the pledge we are bascially telling all the other citizens that we live along side with and within the same country that we pledge to try to uphold the same values for them that we uphold for ourselves. The pledge was designed to tell each other that we would be willing to sacrifice ourselves for our fellow neighbors to help protect them, if they also would sacrifice themselves to save YOU! The pledge has nothing to do with an icon, it simple states within the pledge how to honor each other and how to show your honor for your fellow citizens by performing the particular ritual that is performed during the Pledge of Allegiance.

And to any of you that try to use the whole argument regarding the U.S. having more imprisoned people than any other recognized state, remember the reason why that is the case is because we value life more than other countires. We would rather use imprisonment as punishment as opposed to just beheading you or electrocution, etc. Hmmmm, does Iran put up with people breaking their laws just by putting them in a candy ass prison? No, it's a very torturous ordeal over there.
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The reason we incarcerate more people than other countries seems to follow the "war on drugs". Prior to the "war on drugs" the USA had a much lower incarceration rate.

Comparing the "nominal freedom" in this country to more oppressive countries does not justify the high incarceration rate.

I'm curius, why do you feel compelled to pledge allegiance to a country that wants to put you in jail for the crime of self ownership?
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
lopezri, let me remind you: americans dont DO sacrifice anymore.

that shit is so WWII

fuck, i want to sacrifice to help with the greatest environmental disaster ever, and CAN'T.

sacrifice is SOOOOOOOO passe
 
Mindmelted

Mindmelted

Well-Known Member
Really,we have volunteer training down here in florida now for the oil spill coming this way.

So that excuse does not hold any water at all.
 
Murfy

Murfy

Well-Known Member
lopezri said:
AAAaaaarrrggggh. I really wish some of you people would read the initial posts before just throwing out any ole' argument just to stir the pot (so to speak). My first two posts in this thread sum up the whole thing with the Pledge of Allegiance but apparently there are just too many of you that can't read with any comprehension. The Pledge of Allegiance IS a pledge from each individual person reciting it, to each legal citizen of the United States. It IS NOT a pledge to the Republic. They just use the word republic to mean the all inclusive states that make up the whole country. When we recite the pledge we are bascially telling all the other citizens that we live along side with and within the same country that we pledge to try to uphold the same values for them that we uphold for ourselves. The pledge was designed to tell each other that we would be willing to sacrifice ourselves for our fellow neighbors to help protect them, if they also would sacrifice themselves to save YOU! The pledge has nothing to do with an icon, it simple states within the pledge how to honor each other and how to show your honor for your fellow citizens by performing the particular ritual that is performed during the Pledge of Allegiance.

And to any of you that try to use the whole argument regarding the U.S. having more imprisoned people than any other recognized state, remember the reason why that is the case is because we value life more than other countires. We would rather use imprisonment as punishment as opposed to just beheading you or electrocution, etc. Hmmmm, does Iran put up with people breaking their laws just by putting them in a candy ass prison? No, it's a very torturous ordeal over there.
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i agree, and if you don't look at things this way, then the pledge IS socialistic, instead of hearing the pledge and saying "this isn't america anymore" SAY IT, and make america "it"
many of the adversities we face today are easily surmountable, but they defeat us every day. in baseball it's called going down with the bat on your shoulder
 
Xrtnfx

Xrtnfx

Active Member
Padawanbater2 said:
Respect is earned, not demanded and not given simply because society says it's right.
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They earned it. Get with it man

To compare the U.S. to the Nazis in any way shows you don't have a clue... You're smart, and you have good opinions. Unfortunately you are totally off on this one
 
N

NoDrama

Well-Known Member
Murfy said:
i agree, and if you don't look at things this way, then the pledge IS socialistic, instead of hearing the pledge and saying "this isn't america anymore" SAY IT, and make america "it"
many of the adversities we face today are easily surmountable, but they defeat us every day. in baseball it's called going down with the bat on your shoulder
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The problem is so many are afraid to get a swing and a miss.
 
N

NoDrama

Well-Known Member
lopezri said:
AAAaaaarrrggggh. I really wish some of you people would read the initial posts before just throwing out any ole' argument just to stir the pot (so to speak). My first two posts in this thread sum up the whole thing with the Pledge of Allegiance but apparently there are just too many of you that can't read with any comprehension. The Pledge of Allegiance IS a pledge from each individual person reciting it, to each legal citizen of the United States. It IS NOT a pledge to the Republic. They just use the word republic to mean the all inclusive states that make up the whole country. When we recite the pledge we are bascially telling all the other citizens that we live along side with and within the same country that we pledge to try to uphold the same values for them that we uphold for ourselves. The pledge was designed to tell each other that we would be willing to sacrifice ourselves for our fellow neighbors to help protect them, if they also would sacrifice themselves to save YOU! The pledge has nothing to do with an icon, it simple states within the pledge how to honor each other and how to show your honor for your fellow citizens by performing the particular ritual that is performed during the Pledge of Allegiance.

And to any of you that try to use the whole argument regarding the U.S. having more imprisoned people than any other recognized state, remember the reason why that is the case is because we value life more than other countires. We would rather use imprisonment as punishment as opposed to just beheading you or electrocution, etc. Hmmmm, does Iran put up with people breaking their laws just by putting them in a candy ass prison? No, it's a very torturous ordeal over there.
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Exactly how Marx, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, and Kim Jong Il would perceive it also.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Xrtnfx said:
They earned it. Get with it man

To compare the U.S. to the Nazis in any way shows you don't have a clue... You're smart, and you have good opinions. Unfortunately you are totally off on this one
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Who earned it?

When did I compare the US to the Nazi's?

That's not what this is about - that's just what I was reminded of as I was standing there, in the stands, watching everyone, all these people, 5 or 6 hundred of them, all reciting this pledge, this pledge that doesn't mean shit to me anymore. I used to hold it in the highest regard possible, when I was a naive kid and didn't know anything about the real world. It's not the truth. It's a lie. You don't respect the people who fought for the right to say the things they wanted to say or face death for saying it by promoting the blind obedience to authority many of those same men fought against, and gave their lives for. You do it by remembering who they were and what they valued.

Don't let Big Brother tell you who to give respect to.
 
Xrtnfx

Xrtnfx

Active Member
Padawanbater2 said:


When did I compare the US to the Nazi's?

that's just what I was reminded of as I was standing there, in the stands, watching everyone, all these people, 5 or 6 hundred of them, all reciting this pledge, this pledge that doesn't mean shit to me anymore.
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That thought process and the nice picture you pasted before seems to do the trick. It's funny because when I was a naive little kid I thought the same way you do now. I understand where you are coming from. Just realize that you have your own mind, just because you honor your country and recite a 20 second pledge doesn't mean you're a brainwashed zombie.

My allegiance is with the flag of the united states of America, where the hell else would it be? If yours is not, then you have every right not to participate, people are just going to see you as a disrespectful kid, rather than an intellectual.
 
Fullmoon kid

Fullmoon kid

Active Member
Xrtnfx said:
That thought process and the nice picture you pasted before seems to do the trick. It's funny because when I was a naive little kid I thought the same way you do now. I understand where you are coming from. Just realize that you have your own mind, just because you honor your country and recite a 20 second pledge doesn't mean you're a brainwashed zombie.

My allegiance is with the flag of the united states of America, where the hell else would it be? If yours is not, then you have every right not to participate, people are just going to see you as a disrespectful kid, rather than an intellectual.
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Gotta say , totally agree
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
The pledge is brainwash, plain and simple. A person shall know his country by how it treats its citizens. This country has completly abandoned its citizens interests in favor of corporate and rich mens interests. When a country is loved, is is because of the way it treats its citizens. Most any citizen with less than a 50K a year salary knows damn well how the country feels about them, basically they don't exist except for income taxes and gun fodder for the military. When I was young, up to about 19 when I joined the Army and got an eye opening education, I believed all the hype about loving my country. Then I awoke, and found out how the country felt about me. They (the government) could care less whether I lived or died, just send money. When a government, the richest on the planet, denies health care to its citizens in order to give the rich and corporations large tax incentives, one must consider just whom they are interested in, it is certainly not the welfare of the average citizen. The more I see of the cold blooded righties on this site and the country in general, the more I believe the revolution should start with your boss. One of these days the people will wake up and take back their country from the corporatists and the elites. Wake me when this starts, otherwise all I have is the vote of the lessor of the two evils, not much to look forward to. Just the thought of a far right government sends shivers through my timbers, losing SS and Medicare would drive me to the streets with a righty in my sights, if I'm destined to starve and be homeless, I'll sure as hell take a few selfish bastards with me.
 
Xrtnfx

Xrtnfx

Active Member
medicineman said:
The pledge is brainwash, plain and simple. A person shall know his country by how it treats its citizens. This country has completly abandoned its citizens interests in favor of corporate and rich mens interests. When a country is loved, is is because of the way it treats its citizens. Most any citizen with less than a 50K a year salary knows damn well how the country feels about them, basically they don't exist except for income taxes and gun fodder for the military. When I was young, up to about 19 when I joined the Army and got an eye opening education, I believed all the hype about loving my country. Then I awoke, and found out how the country felt about me. They (the government) could care less whether I lived or died, just send money. When a government, the richest on the planet, denies health care to its citizens in order to give the rich and corporations large tax incentives, one must consider just whom they are interested in, it is certainly not the welfare of the average citizen. The more I see of the cold blooded righties on this site and the country in general, the more I believe the revolution should start with your boss. One of these days the people will wake up and take back their country from the corporatists and the elites. Wake me when this starts, otherwise all I have is the vote of the lessor of the two evils, not much to look forward to. Just the thought of a far right government sends shivers through my timbers, losing SS and Medicare would drive me to the streets with a righty in my sights, if I'm destined to starve and be homeless, I'll sure as hell take a few selfish bastards with me.
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What are you talking about? Have you heard of welfare? You know, sit on your ass all day, pop out some kids and collect your check? You don't have to go to war you know? If you choose to, then yes you run the risk of dying for your country, or as you would put it the corporate fat cats.

Ever heard of the American dream? It is very real and all you have to do is put in the work and even you could achieve it. So many opportunities this country offers people, start taking advantage of them. Instead you write miserable anti-righty speeches and try to shift all attention to that.

I love this country, I get a free ride to college thanks to the government (bright futures), a decent job that allows me to pay my bills, freedom of speech and expression, and opportunity for a great life. If your life is so horrible do something about it, I did.
 
lopezri

lopezri

Well-Known Member
That's awfully cowardice of you. If you don't have anything worth dying for, then you are not living.
 
lopezri

lopezri

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
lopezri, let me remind you: americans dont DO sacrifice anymore.

that shit is so WWII

fuck, i want to sacrifice to help with the greatest environmental disaster ever, and CAN'T.

sacrifice is SOOOOOOOO passe
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Ooops, I forgot to include the post I was replying to in the previous post. Here it is.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Xrtnfx said:
That thought process and the nice picture you pasted before seems to do the trick. It's funny because when I was a naive little kid I thought the same way you do now. I understand where you are coming from. Just realize that you have your own mind, just because you honor your country and recite a 20 second pledge doesn't mean you're a brainwashed zombie.

My allegiance is with the flag of the united states of America, where the hell else would it be? If yours is not, then you have every right not to participate, people are just going to see you as a disrespectful kid, rather than an intellectual.
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I'm not sure if I'm explaining it correctly. I'm not saying by reciting the pledge you're a brainwashed zombie. I'm saying that the way society views it, as documented by this thread, is wrong. People who choose not to recite it are ostracized and disciplined. That's some seriously Nazi shit right there. I thought I had the freedom of choice in this country. The entire thing is one huge contradiction to anyone paying attention. It does not honor anyone. It demeans their memory and fails to live up to the message it sends. All while presenting a false image of patriotism - just like the religions do with morality - to get a free pass through society.

Like I said before, I don't give out free passes.
 
lopezri

lopezri

Well-Known Member
I find it interesting that there are so many of you here that damn the United States for their current political affairs, stating that the Pledge of Allegiance is brainwashing now because it doesn't represent the country that you once loved. Doesn't it make sense that the reason the country IS NOT what it used to be is because the political leaders of the last century were pretty much trying to change the country into what you keep insisting on demanding anyway? I mean look at it this way. . . if the country continued to operate the way it did PRIOR to Lincoln, FDR, Carter, Clinton, Bush, Obama, etc. . . then you would basically be on your own. There would be no welfare to take care of anyone who happened to get hurt in any of the wars that the U.S. fought in order to continue to remain a sovereign nation to allow their citizens to keep their freedoms.

Everything that you have demanded, YOUR liberal, overreaching government has tried to foster for you - they've tried to give you food so you don't have to grow or harvest it yourself, they've tried to give you free education so you don't have to shell out to get at least 12 years of an educational understanding to be able to continue to operate within and as one with the rest of the world, they've provided free clinics to assist those that couldn't afford to go to a private doctor. These are all things that the liberal agenda has taken control of and has perverted to the extent that it doesn't work properly anymore because too many people would rather be dependent ON that system instead of trying to provide INTO the system for the ones that really need it.

The people of the U.S. never took away the right for people to grow and consume what they would like. That right was taken away from us by a liberal government that felt it was more important to allow William Randolph Hearst to grab control of the paper mill industry to be able to spread their liberal agendas through print at an extremely cost effective price. The way that was achieved was first by printing yellow journalism propaganda about the dangers and addictive qualities of "marijuana", a cheap Mexican substitute for tobacco. That "marijuana" plant WAS NOT hemp, it was a cheap knock off of the tobacco plant. The HEMP plant has a number of beneficial uses from PAPER, to medicine, to oil, fabrics, building products, etc. All things that Bill Hearst wanted control of. So he chummed up with the liberal governmental powers that be, and assisted them in gaining control of businesses that didn't belong to them so they could benefit from the profits and the votes generated from their cheap, mind controlling propagandas that were set forth, and leaving the freedom loving citizens of the U.S. out to dry.
 
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