Why should I respect your beliefs?

Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
Kaendar said:
Well I think you focus too much on the potential harm rather than the good that is done around the world everyday.
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Having people honestly review their beliefs and admit when answers are pretend will not hinder their good will, they will still do good things.



With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. -Steven Weinberg,
 
Shannon Alexander

Shannon Alexander

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
It's not a lack of evidence. The existing evidence is in direct opposition to the idea of a god.

Every time something new is found which God was responsible for previously, the goal posts are moved and usually, what's found is rejected until the church is forced to accept it.
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Sorry, I should have stated my position a little clearer as you seem stuck on the idea of God as pertaining to the Christian religion etc... and not just the Idea of a god...
 
cannabineer

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
Zaehet Strife said:
I always liked this quote.

View attachment 2235619
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I would disagree.
Cussing someone out is fruitless and inelegant, rather like a cheap Continental breakfast.
But saying "I am offended" in its place can have real value ... if your interlocutor meant no offense, it grants both parties an easy means of resolution without loss of face. It effectively says "I am extending a path of negotiation to you, should you choose/happen to be good enough to use it". Jmo. cn
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
I don't know. I think there has been an instititional attempt to force us to believe that "words matter." It is billions in business.

I was raised, on the idea that physical things can hurt me, but not words. Words may seem offensive but they cannot be.

It is much better, imo, to ask, "Are you intending to be offensive?" That will clear it up and everyone can have more face. And it will show you are containing your gut reaction for the moment to seek clarity and to put the fellow more gently on notice.

My gut reaction to "I'm offended." is "so what?" Of couse, I'm much more beer bottle than champange.
 
cannabineer

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
Doer said:
I don't know. I think there has been an institution attempt to force of to believe that "words matter." If was raise, on the idea that physical things can hurt me, but not words. Words may seem offensive but they cannot be.

It is much better to asked, "Are you intending to be offensive?" That will clear it up and everyone can have more face. And it will show you are
containing your gut reaction for the moment to seek clarity and to put the fellow more gently on notice.

My gut reaction to "I'm offended." is "so what?" Of course, I'm much more beer bottle than champagne.
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Me otoh ... I live and breathe words. I completely embrace the idea that they matter, that they can be the hinge of things, and that there are forms that are better than others. If I were to receive "so what?" as an answer to "I am offended", I would at once recognize someone who has just very probably declared contempt beyond renegotiation. It's a naked "fuck you, nobody". I believe that an appreciation of nuance transcends traditional class boundaries ... to define true class. I peremptorily reject "street" manners. Jmo. cn
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
Well, as I said, no one can accuse me of class, crass maybe. But, I do try to keep the gut reaction silent and use the form of the question I suggested. :)
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
And we do. We both prefer rancourless discussion, I hope.

So, let's explore. And let us say, for the sake of discussion, that we are not talking about the patent, obvious intent to offend. And we are casual strangers.

When someone announces, "I'm offended." Are they not offering up the first attack? Doesn't that tone put me on defensiveness?

You are abruptly stating that you have been wronged and suggesting you require apology as a social form before proceeding. How am I to know what you find offensive? And as a gut reaction, I take offense that you assume that.

We both, being offended, in another age, it would be, choose seconds and meet at dawn. The "sticks and stones" arguement is what really and finally ended sactioned dueling, as i see it. Oh sure rules were made to not decimate the ranks of malehood. But, society finally changed.

I am too serious, OK. So what? I just wonder about these turns in history and how it is coming back to allow "offended" in the purely self-defined way. And, if I may be ulta-serious, teachers, etc, are being killed because of the return.
 
thagooroo

thagooroo

Member
You put it perfectly and if anything we should practice being understanding that everyone has different beliefs based on what they have seen, heard and been taught/learned I personally learn a lot from all on this site and all my thoughts are views change with life experiences and constant learning I think religion retards learning
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
It may. But, in the East it it is said, in the end we must pass thru Guru to have our own enlightenment. By learning in religion and then exploring the truth for myself has lead me to accelerated understanding. Al least... I have no complaints on that score.
 
Cut.Throat.

Cut.Throat.

Well-Known Member
Doer said:
It may. But, in the East it it is said, in the end we must pass thru Guru to have our own enlightenment. By learning in religion and then exploring the truth for myself has lead me to accelerated understanding. Al least... I have no complaints on that score.
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999! Make your next post count. :lol:
 
WyoGrow

WyoGrow

Active Member
There is no requirement for you to respect my "beliefs". But so long as my beliefs do not interfere with your life and your beliefs then what is the issue??? You can choose to be offended by them all you want... but if they don't actually affect you then I can't see an issue. What I feel needs to be respected is that if my beliefs fit the criteria I mentioned and you attempt to interfere in my life asserting your beliefs over mine you'd be well served to not be surprised by the impending foot about to be wedge in your ass.
 
cannabineer

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
WyoGrow said:
There is no requirement for you to respect my "beliefs". But so long as my beliefs do not interfere with your life and your beliefs then what is the issue??? You can choose to be offended by them all you want... but if they don't actually affect you then I can't see an issue. What I feel needs to be respected is that if my beliefs fit the criteria I mentioned and you attempt to interfere in my life asserting your beliefs over mine you'd be well served to not be surprised by the impending foot about to be wedge in your ass.
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Fast-moving feet are a traditional tool in philosophic discourse. Said Samuel Johnson of Bishop Berkeley's immaterialist concept: "I refute it this!" while kicking a stone unto detectable bejeezus deficiency. Toes of Honor. cn
 
cannabineer

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
Doer said:
And we do. We both prefer rancourless discussion, I hope.

So, let's explore. And let us say, for the sake of discussion, that we are not talking about the patent, obvious intent to offend. And we are casual strangers.

When someone announces, "I'm offended." Are they not offering up the first attack? Doesn't that tone put me on defensiveness?

You are abruptly stating that you have been wronged and suggesting you require apology as a social form before proceeding. How am I to know what you find offensive? And as a gut reaction, I take offense that you assume that.

We both, being offended, in another age, it would be, choose seconds and meet at dawn. The "sticks and stones" arguement is what really and finally ended sactioned dueling, as i see it. Oh sure rules were made to not decimate the ranks of malehood. But, society finally changed.

I am too serious, OK. So what? I just wonder about these turns in history and how it is coming back to allow "offended" in the purely self-defined way. And, if I may be ulta-serious, teachers, etc, are being killed because of the return.
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If someone said to me "I'm offended", I would view it as a way to tell me that I might have overstepped a boundary. I see courtesy there, and would respond with respect ... perhaps asking what the point of offense was. If the offended party explains, we're on our way to reconciliation. Sometimes that requires ... conciliation. My opinion.

I don't know what you mean by teachers being killed ... can you tell me who what where? cn
 
olylifter420

olylifter420

Well-Known Member
follow whatever the hell you want...


it seems you have a major issue with individuals right to practice their religion or beliefs...

Get over it man...There is no point in what you are trying to do on the internet...

Go out and make a MOVEMENT of some sorts in REAL LIFE rather then spew your bigotry on the web where no one can sock you in the face for it...


That is an unbiased opinion... thats all...


Padawanbater2 said:
If I believe your beliefs, when practiced in the real world, are dangerous?
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Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
olylifter420 said:
it seems you have a major issue with individuals right to practice their religion or beliefs...
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When their religion or beliefs hurt people, yeah. You do too, you're just too stubborn to admit it.

olylifter420 said:
Get over it man...There is no point in what you are trying to do on the internet...
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It wouldn't bother people like you so much if what I was doing wasn't accomplishing anything.

olylifter420 said:
Go out and make a MOVEMENT of some sorts in REAL LIFE rather then spew your bigotry on the web where no one can sock you in the face for it...
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Words upset you to the point of violence. That says plenty about you and the confidence you have in your beliefs.

When all else fails, pull the bigot card. Just like all the other ignoramuses around here who spout off the first personal attack that comes to their mind when they lose control of their emotions, quote it or STFU.
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
cannabineer said:
If someone said to me "I'm offended", I would view it as a way to tell me that I might have overstepped a boundary. I see courtesy there, and would respond with respect ... perhaps asking what the point of offense was. If the offended party explains, we're on our way to reconciliation. Sometimes that requires ... conciliation. My opinion.

I don't know what you mean by teachers being killed ... can you tell me who what where? cn
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Well, to get closer to the point, I have family members in the teacher business. We recently had a long discussion about the concept of safety for teachers and other public employees. And I don't think we have to list these events that are accelerating in schools and elsewhere, even in the home. It's not guns, really, it is the warpped concept of gangland respect. This concept fits certain political agendas.

OK, so in polite society we have PC smoozed our way around this shift in ethics. Words matter. Fine. Perhaps there is trauma, at a young age with words alone. I get that. But, now we see, below the edge of polite society a gang culture emerging as consequence. And teachers live in fear they don't offend the little monsters. We have unintentionally created the very mob we fear. This more clear?
 
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