Is hydroponics better for the environment? I think it is.

[Heisenberg]

you know exactly what I mean. You are just trying to stir an argument

Argument is how differences are turned into commonalities. It is the entire point of debate. Asking someone to define terms is a way of avoiding derailment, not a way of instigating contention. When you say "chemicals are bad," it's confusing. It invites equivocation.

'“If you wish to converse with me,” said Voltaire, “define your terms.” How many a debate would have been deflated into a paragraph if the disputants had dared to define their terms! This is the alpha and omega of logic, the heart and soul of it, that every important term in serious discourse shall be subjected to the strictest scrutiny and definition. It is difficult, and ruthlessly tests the mind; but once done it is half of any task.' – Will Durant, The Story of Philosophy

 

[churchhaze]

Actually, when someone says 'chemicals are bad', it basically invalidates anything further they have to say about anything scientific. There is nothing to be gained in debating scientific subjects with uneducated people who aren't willing to use the scientific method to come up with conclusions of their own..

 

[hyroot]

You're asking me to check my ego, yet you're calling my product poison. Get over yourself. Your product probably isn't even that good. If quality was poor when you grew hydroponically for 10 years, you are to blame.

nuff said

 

[churchhaze]

View attachment 3428411

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nuff said

It looks like weed. I can't smell it, taste it, or get high by it. All i can say is it doesn't look dead. You managed to make it to harvest. Good work. None of that makes your point that it's by far superior in quality, or that it's better for the environment. That's just a bunch of made up quackery. I never doubted that you can grow pot.

 

[Dr. Who]

I don't accept the premise that your product is better, nor that you can produce it cheaper than me. You constantly admit that hydroponics (not what those farmers are using) will result in higher yields. They use dirt with urea fertilizers, not inert media with nitrate salts) . We use electricity to grow. If i yield twice as much per watt, it means I'm using half the electricity per gram of product. That means it's cheaper for me to grow hydroponically than it is for you to grow in dirt. What's weird is that most dirt growers admit this, yet instead of switching over, they bash the quality of their competitors with unfounded claims.

I must say that hydro has it's place....BTW....urea is technically.......organic......Many will argue with me on this point.....just because some "board" of the god OMARI says it's not....doesn't change the fact that it is! I choose NOT to use it in my WO soils for what it does...it is one fast acting way to N burn..

Back to hydro.....When the P runs out,,,,so will hydro.....Looks to be about the same time as oil will....."experts" say 50 years...

Back to turds and cover crops!

 

[unwine99]

I'd just like to add that I've seen plenty of organic products like kelp meal with cancer/birth-defect warning labels due to their heavy metal content.

 

[hyroot]

It looks like weed.

you are very observant. you said my product isnt any good. well there you go some frosty ass fire that stinks up a whole block

 

[hyroot]

I'd just like to add that I've seen plenty of organic products like kelp meal with cancer/birth-defect warning labels due to their heavy metal content.

those were liquid kelps from grow more. not organic.

 

[churchhaze]

you are very observant. you said my product isnt any good. well there you go some frosty ass fire that stinks up a whole block

To me, it looks like a poison stick. Don't throw it in a pond or it might kill all the fish.

 

[hyroot]

To me, it looks like a poison stick. Don't throw it in a pond or it might kill all the fish.

thats your ego and you feeling threatened. you are kicking yourself right now. its ok. dont worry be happy.

 

[churchhaze]

those were liquid kelps from grow more. not organic.

Inorganic kelp...?

 

[unwine99]

those were liquid kelps from grow more. not organic.

Nope it was definitely, pure, unadulterated kelp meal -- not liquid kelp.

 

[hyroot]

Inorganic kelp...?

liquid kelps have the same chemicals found in a bottle of drano. dry kelp or fresh kelp on the other hand only what was in the ocean in its vicinity

 

[churchhaze]

thats your ego and you feeling threatened. you are kicking yourself right now. its ok. dont worry be happy.

I'm very happy with my product, and I yield more too (at least that's the excuse organic LED growers always use. "you only yielded more than me because...")

 

[churchhaze]

liquid kelps have the same chemicals found in a bottle of drano. dry kelp or fresh kelp on the other hand only what was in the ocean in its vicinity

So does hemlock. It's called lye. It's what you use to saponify your hash.

 

[hyroot]

Nope it was definitely, pure, unadulterated kelp meal -- not liquid kelp.

ive seen that same label on grow more bottles but i never have seen it never on on acadian kelp or down to earth kelp

 

[Heisenberg]

thats your ego and you feeling threatened. you are kicking yourself right now. its ok. dont worry be happy.

You appear to just make up reality as it suits you. Does it make you feel better to believe that he is feeling threatened? Truth is, those buds you posted look awesome, but I can post some just as awesome looking that were grown hydroponically. I doubt you would accept from just my pics that my product is superior in quality. Why should we accept that your product is superior just from your pics? That's a ridiculous expectation.

 

[hyroot]

You appear to just make up reality as it suits you. Does it make you feel better to believe that he is feeling threatened? Truth is, those buds you posted look awesome, but I can post some just as awesome looking that were grown hydroponically. I doubt you would accept from just my pics that my product is superior in quality. Why should we accept that your product is superior just from your pics? That's a ridiculous expectation.

why don't you read is post first before replying to mine. cherry picking doesn't work

 

[Heisenberg]

why don't you read is post first before replying to mine. cherry picking doesn't work

Cherry picking? Yet another term you seem to misunderstand. I see that CH made a nasty comment. Doesn't mean it's because he feels threatened, Maybe it's just because he doesn't like you. Maybe he has contempt for selective anti-intellectualism. Maybe he's being ironic. Point is, we can tell nothing from your pics except that you made it to harvest. Just as you could tell nothing from pics I might post. It's hardly "nuff said."

Going by your declaration, "chemicals are bad", we must assume the product you posted is bad, because it is impossible to have grown it without chemicals. This is why I asked you to define your terms. Do you really mean artificial is bad? Synthetic? What, exactly, is your distinction? It's not fair to simply say "you know what I mean" to someone who is genuinely asking what you mean. You accuse me of only wanting to argue, yet here you are making post after post contributing to an argument. Apparently you feel entitled to refrain from arguments which challenge you and instead argue only for your twisted, unsupported narrative which you cannot clearly define.

 

[churchhaze]

So far you've said we create poison stalks, that everyone agrees "chem grown" plants are inferior, when clearly we're all having a debate on it and don't agree on that at all. The discussion turned into ratio of K:Ca, and how a high K reduces brix levels. Well i can lower K with hydroponics. Most soil is already very low in K compared with hydroponic mixes, which tend to be very high in cations in general.

Frankly, I'm sick and tired of you calling everyone's products poison. I don't feel threatened at all because I know what you're saying a complete lie and I don't have any customers to lose to you anyway. Otherwise, yeah. I would feel threatened by my competition using lies to win over my customers. It's unethical to make the claims you do about heavy metal, just to provide them with a product even higher in heavy metals than the hydroponics counter part. It's unethical to speak about chemicals with authority and conviction, especially when the only people who believe you are not chemically minded themselves. It means you will likely make a lot of ignorant mistakes, and your customers will have to suffer the consequences.